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Dec. 21, 2020

#24 - SNSW Hour 1 - NFL Predictions Retrospective

#24 - SNSW Hour 1 - NFL Predictions Retrospective

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#5 - NFC Preditions
#6 - AFC Preditions

On this episode of Missing the Point, it's part one of our Sunday Night Sports Wrap.
In the first hour, we revisit our AFC and NFC predictions amongst the topics.
Will Mike apologize for picking the lines to win the NFC north?
What does Joe think about Josh Allen now the Buffalo Bills are officially AFC East champions for the first time since 1995.
Stay tuned to find out.

Tweet your questions to @MTPshow with hashtag #askMTP, email us at Craig@MTPshow.com, or leave us a voicemail on our website!

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Transcript
Craig D'Alessandro:

On this episode of missing the point, it's part one of our Sunday night's for trap. And the first hour we revisit our AFC and NFC predictions amongst the topics. Well Mike apologize for picking the lines to win the NFC north. What's this Joe? Think about Josh Allen now the Buffalo Bills are officially AFC East champions for the first time since 1995. Stay tuned to find out. But first, some housekeeping missing. The point is a one hour weekly podcast recapping the biggest stories in the world of sports. What's the New England flavor? the show notes and transcript of today's episode can be found in the description box below, as well as on our website, www dot MTP show.com. If you're new to the show, and like we're here, consider subscribing. It's the easiest way to see when we publish new episodes. We are on iTunes, Spotify, Google and wherever you get your podcasts. Be sure to rate us and leave a review. If any of our shows we always appreciate your feedback. Also, be sure to follow us on all of our social medias. All of our links will be in the show notes and check out our brand new website WWW dot MTP show calm, that's MTP show.com. And now this is missing the point. What is all relative?

Dave Clarke:

Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls. Hello and welcome to the Sunday night sports rep brought to you by missing the point come in. Gather round, find a chair. That's it. Don't be shy. There's room for everyone. I'm your host this week TK sisal Dave Clark, many people have speculated what the K and DK sizzle stands for and I often tell them that it's versatile much like the F in weezy f baby. It has many meanings depending on the situation for today because science. I had a banana for breakfast so it stands for potassium. k for potassium. No wonder people don't trust scientists guys. Today I have the entire gang of misfits in their dwells that makeup missing the point and the Sunday night sports wrap crew with me. And we were in for a raucous good time over the next couple of hours. A small bit of housekeeping before I introduce the team please look out for our interview with Celtics pre and post game host Abby chin releases Tuesday, the 22nd we talked to her about her career. Her experiences with Celtics legends like scowl and Tommy heinsohn. And she enlightened us as to some her experiences with much maligned All Star guard cryosurgery Kyrie Irving while he played for the seas, so look out for that, and another special guest will announce later coming up. She's also from Celtics land. Now, without any further gilding the lily, and absolutely no more ado, I bring you the lovable cast of characters that will be guiding you through this journey of the eyes and ears. First up, we have Mike Mark Angelo, it's often been speculated, but never proven that Mike is not actually one person but three children standing on top of one another in a trench coat in order to get into a rated R movie. Those children's names Mike, Mark, and Angela. So how do you three How are you guys doing?

Michael Marcangelo:

We're doing great. Yeah, thank you so much. That's just a great joke. I've never heard anything like that before. Actually, that's the best one I've ever heard. But I love it. Thank you.

Dave Clarke:

Well, I would love to know since it's been a month since we've been together I'd love to know your favorite sports moment thing that happened over the past 30 days. Why don't you enlighten us?

Michael Marcangelo:

It's actually two things. So it's a task sorry. So person

Dave Clarke:

one, but that's fine. You guys just do whatever you want.

Michael Marcangelo:

It's a tie because I know that the first thing you don't consider a sport, but it was actually that happened yesterday and it was Tiger Woods and his son Charlie. That warms my heart.

Unknown:

I know that

Michael Marcangelo:

Yeah, I don't care about that. That 175 rocque and aliens four feet from the hole that was awesome to see. And you just don't get to see Tiger Woods kind of humanized like that. So I thought that was cool. And then the two game losing streak from the Steelers man just absolutely. Wow. Smile, man. So yeah, it's got a great month.

Dave Clarke:

We've started off controversially and aggressively already I love that keep that same energy. So that brings us over to the man known as the real BK Bob Kelly. He also goes by Bobby, Rob, Robert and sometimes inexplicably Fergus, the man with more name changes than john Cougar Mellencamp Ladies and gentlemen, the artist formerly known as mints Bob Kelly, how are you sir?

Rob Kelly:

I'm good, man. How are you?

Dave Clarke:

I'm really good. I'm really good. Now that I'm here with you guys. Tell me same question. Your favorite thing that happened in sports over the last 30 days.

Rob Kelly:

So my favorite thing over the past three days? It has to be with Mr. Jackson shitting his pants and leading a game winning touchdown drive. I'm on Danette football. He says he didn't shit his pants. But I'm telling you I've never seen someone run in that fashion without pooping their pants. It

Dave Clarke:

was a full lunch. It was a full clench happening.

Rob Kelly:

There's no doubt about it. That is a call the cramps lock.

Dave Clarke:

They call the cramps but that was a very waspy way to say right now he's pooping himself. Yes. I totally agree. I I enjoy that moment also thank you for sharing number one it's it's it's really good to like bring bring poop in early you know as it is a running theme of the Sunday night sports wrap and missing the point now, over to one of my favorite people an educator that Some speculate is the inspiration for the 1988 film standard deliver after teaching calculus to a bunch of kids that didn't want to learn, but that rumor is on true unfortunately, he's actually the inspiration for 1995 film Dangerous Minds because of his striking resemblance to Michelle Pfeiffer Ladies and gentlemen, please stand up deliver for the man himself. rayshawn volcanion Buchanan How are you old friend Tell me your favorite sports moment last month please

Rayshawn Buchanan:

have good man that was awesome. Um, I'm definitely a dangerous mind too. But a favor true Yeah, yeah, for sure. I'm actually I'm gonna keep it in house and after the first CP episode that we did actually was my favorite sports moment man man I had sick about Yeah, you know so yeah, so just to speak about survivor saved to speak about the Montreal screwjob like that to me was just awesome because you know someone who was a big wrestling fan as myself and you know Mike and you know craigers and then obviously, you know, having you on their brother man, it was it was awesome. So there's like such dangerous mods the one good I'm ready to go.

Dave Clarke:

I appreciate the the you guys having me on and I appreciate the shameless plug for our own show, uh, whilst on our show, so I really did appreciate that it was slick marketing sorry to be so cumbersome and calling it out. But inevitably Next we have smokin Joe Malkin often referred to as Broadway Joe. Many scholars of the Sunday night sports rap have suggested that his nickname comes from famous New York Jets Broadway Joe Nemeth, but not true. Mr. Malcolm, Mr. Malkin had his nickname long before name is because of his incredible ability to recite every lyric in order to Les Mis. You don't believe me? He's about to do it the entire thing. That's the entire show. He's gonna do it right now. For everybody at home. Nevermind, we don't have time. Sorry. Craig's telling me on the side that we don't have enough time.

Craig D'Alessandro:

I was about to say. I was about to say that. It's two hours. But

Dave Clarke:

yeah, okay, fine. I pushed for the full score of lame is But Joe unfortunately, you just gonna have to give us your sports takes. Joe, tell me your favorite sports mom in the last 30 days since you've been on Hi. Hi. Hi.

Joe Malkin:

Well, Dave, I was gonna say that you really put me on the spot there. So I was gonna pre record it and just release it as a podcast episode. But I think we'll hold off on that. So I mean, for Joe's Christmas album. Yeah, I, I think in a Christmas album might be the way to go. So I'm gonna go the same way as rayshawn here. There's been a lot of things that have happened in the last month since we last saw all of you. But I'm gonna plug our other interview that will be coming out next week. The interview guys did with Abby that comes out Tuesday is phenomenal. But we as Dave teased earlier, we also interviewed another woman from Celtics land and that's tricky because naric to also bring it around and bring in what Bobbi said she talked about poop. And and Lamar Jackson and herself her own story. That was just a great interview. I was very down to earth a lot like Abby in that way. The two of them are friends, Bobby and I had a blast doing that interview, and I really can't wait for everybody to hear it. But yeah, I was gonna decide if I was gonna go down the controversial road. But since we're gonna touch on the NBA tonight, I'm gonna save that.

Dave Clarke:

Alright, Joe's saving it for later. I love it. All right. We're here. We've introduced everybody, but I don't I don't want to forget one of the most important people. The man who invented the flux capacitor of missing the point and is about to throw us in as the lorry and take it to 88 the best producer in the game. Craig D'Alessandro, Mr. De apostrophe allesandro How the heck are you? What's your favorite sports memory the last 30 days, Craig,

Craig D'Alessandro:

it's been a tremendous 30 days. So the sport of boxing mike tyson came at retirement golani Golovkin. Follow us. Two nights ago, canal rose fall last night. Boxing Hall of Fame was announced earlier this week. It's been a great month for the sport for the sweet science.

Dave Clarke:

Wow, that was very that was very well prepared. And Professor, this is why we don't let Craig talk because he's gonna show us all up. You know, I try and surprise him. We're trying to surprise him and stuff. Yes, that's the reason. So we're gonna get into the show. If, if you're a longtime listener, this Sunday night sports rapid missing the point then you'll know that at the start way back in August, at the start of the NFL season, we prepared an NFL prediction show where we gave one team the NFC and one team, the AFC and everybody guessed at the records of the respective teams in those in those conferences and divisions. And we're kind of at the point we were thinking where we can basically say, if most of the records are correct or incorrect, we're getting there, right. So we thought we'd start things off today by going through and seeing what records We're great, unbelievable predictions by a bunch of people who have a podcast about sports and should know what they're talking about, and what records were insanely wrong. And do you even watch the NFL. So we're going to go back and forth. It's going to be a whale of a time. And I'm going to start off with the NFC team, which I was on, which I'm trying to distance myself from now at this point, but I was on it. And I did contribute to this. When we get to the NBA show later, it's going to be more of I hosted I've been kind of ousted from the team, I think because of some of my predictions. But we'll you know, we'll save you the politics. The NFC team, the NFC East with Bobby's Cowboys, and I figured no better place to start than with the Dallas Cowboys. Gentlemen, the Cowboys you predicted, somewhat embarrassingly to be the division winner at 10 and six, they might still be the division winner, basically, because it's a bit of a world's tallest midget competition over there in the in the NFC East. And, you know, they might be the division winner with what Bobby six six wins. Is that gonna get six wins gonna get you the division over there. They have a four nine, record

Rob Kelly:

five and nine after

Dave Clarke:

five and nine record after today. You guys pretty good tenant six. Bobby, what happened to the Cowboys?

Rob Kelly:

A lot of things happen on the Cowboys. I mean, Dak Prescott's foot falling off was obviously the first thing that happened, or maybe not the first thing that happened, that was the biggest thing that happens to this team. I think if this is the same defense, if this cowboys defense was like this, the entire season that we've been seen the past few weeks would have been a completely different story. Maybe we would have got this point, but no, we weren't.

Michael Marcangelo:

I mean, they had stefon Diggs brother on defensive.

Rob Kelly:

Back to that every time. Yeah,

Michael Marcangelo:

yeah. Because you name drop him. That's what that's how you name dropped.

Dave Clarke:

You actually, if you family relation dropped him. You couldn't even remember his name.

Rob Kelly:

I would. Also I also said Don Terry Poe and Gerald McCoy, both people who are no longer on the Cowboys. So yeah,

Michael Marcangelo:

again, our defense DK came in at six and 10. I said eight, Nate and Bobby came in absolutely hot at 13 and three, so we compromised at 10. Six, and we're still going to lose that point.

Dave Clarke:

So maybe we'll learn our lesson next season with the Homer biases because there's some patriots and bears talk coming up that that that might influence those decisions. Also, the Eagles I thought our call at eight and eight wasn't bad. I you know, I didn't expect them to be this bad. I didn't expect Carson Wentz to be as terrible as he is. I didn't expect that drama to occur. I didn't think that they were like a winning team. But I thought to call them in the middle was okay. A pathetic draw four wins and eight losses later when they're sitting at 481. I don't know. I mean, how could we have predicted that?

Michael Marcangelo:

I think I mean, but I think we kind of did. I mean, like if you go back and listen to it, we all said like, this is completely this. This is gonna be a manic season just like Carson Wentz. Right. And it was, it is I mean, he is a on paper. And I mean, I think we all agree like he's a great quarterback on paper. But then like on the field, he just can't he refuses to run their place. He won't love that. He just won't do it.

Dave Clarke:

And I think I think what really threw off that record too is we predicted Carson Wentz would be average, you know, we picked we predicted he would have some ups he would have some downs. But this season, there literally was no ops from Carson once and that's why it's for eight and one instead of six and eight or whatever. It's cool to know he was going to get benched after 11 or 12 games and all of a sudden be on the trading block. You know like this is a guy with one of the most it turns out damaging but one of the most lucrative contracts at the QB position in in the NFL and you wouldn't have expected I think the Eagles to give up on that quickly especially with the calf hit there by the tape but hey, we're there. We did good on the giants. We said they were going to win five games so far. They've won five games. I don't see them winning much more than that. So I think we're there that's a potential point for us for sure. I was way lower apparently on the on the Washington football team.

Unknown:

They were we all remember

Michael Marcangelo:

I said and I quote if they start Alex Smith, they will go you know five they will win like five out of their next 10 games. Alex Smith hasn't been

Dave Clarke:

he's been playing like the entire defense played all year.

Michael Marcangelo:

You know, I know that like Joe can talk right now cuz you're not gonna silence him. He's nodding his head because he knows that that happened. He was silence of anyone. I said five and 11 if that were the case, we'd have a point.

Joe Malkin:

Go ahead just really doing my best not to butt in there because there's so much to say about this division but on it but but honestly my I do remember when you said that about Washington, but I was also on board with that three and 13 because I just thought they were gonna be a dumpster fire with everything that went on in the offseason that's without

Dave Clarke:

what was that was what was feeding my thoughts was the fact that they didn't have even have a name coming in. Sure. And they

Joe Malkin:

messed up. You know, you know, Ron Rivera, a good coach. I like Ron Rivera. I've liked I liked him as a coach when he was in Carolina, like him in Washington. But there's,

Dave Clarke:

there's defensive coordinator. I liked him then.

Joe Malkin:

Right. So he has the cancer diagnosis which everything looks like it's going well for him on that front. And that was also Another turning point for that team. It wasn't only alex smith coming back, but it was him finishing his last chemo chemotherapy session. And that defense turned it on. I mean, the Washington football team is is fun to watch the giants, the Giants at five and 11. I actually thought that for a little while. I mean, they're five and eight. Now, I still think that they can win that division at eight Nate. They're kind of they've kind of been surprising, but

Unknown:

I would notice, it hurts a lot, actually.

Joe Malkin:

But that Washington pick Mike, I mean, you you were much higher on them than three and 13.

Michael Marcangelo:

I mean, I just feel like you know, at the very least, I would say that they finish again, let's say if they finished like 79 right, we're not gonna get a point, but we would have secondly, it's a great comeback story for Alex Smith. I mean, I just think that is a great story. He come back the way that he did from that horrendous ankle injury and like he almost died 17 surgeries. That's like that's the feel good moment of what is probably the worst division in football. Yeah, and

Joe Malkin:

Dwayne Haskins is not the answer there. We can't

Rob Kelly:

we can't leave this division without speaking about chase young by the way that man oh no absolute animal. He is the reason the Washington that in their secondary is the reason the Washington football team is gonna win this division.

Joe Malkin:

They showed him pregame and I was like, like that man, that he is like a mountain of a man like he's intimidating it like you just look at him. You're like, this is a hell of a football player. But man, he he has not faltered from his entry into the NFL through the season.

Rob Kelly:

I mean, he has just been phenomenal. That's gonna be a dangerous defense. He's everything's that everyone's jus davian clouding was going to be and as what chase young is.

Dave Clarke:

And I feel like something Joe said earlier, which is important to point out is for a while it looked like the giants were going to be the kind of sad division winners of that division. And now it turns out that the team going hot into the playoffs is probably going to be the Washington football team and sounds like we kind of universally say that they deserve it. Right. It's they've been playing well the last few weeks. They've got a wide receiver who have my fantasy team McClaren McClaren, is that how you pronounce his name? He, yeah, he's great, you know, and he makes plays like SportsCenter plays. You know. So you're, if you're seeing your team on on the ESPN top 10 somebody on there is doing something right. So yeah, they might actually it might actually be the saddest team making that playoff berth. But let's move on. The AFC East. Let's go over to the AFC team. Now Ray, Shawn Buchanan and Joe Malkin. Pretty good. You guys did pretty good. I mean, the Jets, you call four and 12? shuba. Yeah, you were there. You were there. But I'm also I cut myself out of the NFC team. You know, it's like, we're gonna be the casualties of war here as we adjust our gameplay format. But the Jets are four and 12. Are you guys called for and 12? They haven't won a game yet. But they're looking like they're about to today, miraculously to in order to maybe specifically help your prediction.

Craig D'Alessandro:

Please, if the Jets win this game against the Rams, and they end up I'm just saying at the end, and they tie with the Jacksonville Jaguars.

Michael Marcangelo:

This is what I said earlier in the show. Craig, would you say that the Patriots are going to tank at the last game of the year so that they don't get the pick?

Craig D'Alessandro:

That would be lovely, because the Jacksonville Jaguars would hold the tiebreaker over the Jets. And, you know, maybe Trevor Lawrence goes to the giant.

Joe Malkin:

It doesn't really matter. Because if I'm Trevor Lawrence, I don't want to play for the jugs or Jack's like,

Rob Kelly:

what what stinks?

Dave Clarke:

Okay, for Trevor? All I can see as you describe that is that meme from like homeland with Claire Danes, and like the math behind her thing, it's like, that's a very specific situation, that if it happens, we can talk about but that's like a little bit too much math for my brain right now. Um, their actual record, they haven't won a game. So what did you expect from the Jets? Did they pretty much meet expectations of being terrible? Are they even worth talking about right now?

Joe Malkin:

They're worth talking about because they are leading the Rams. And I think as the season has gone on, we've looked at that foreign 12 and I've gone man that that was dumb. We should have at least said like three and 13. I mean, even if they go oh, and 16 Great, good for them. But the only reason they're worth talking about is because Adam gates still has a job and we've talked about this on our slack. We've talked about this

Dave Clarke:

on our own. It has been trying to get Adam gays fired since week three. I've been trying to write letters

Joe Malkin:

I've been trying to get gays fired from the New York Jets before he was even emails them every day. Like it was an absolutely terrible hire. I mean, there's so many there's so many better choices for that job before he was hired. And here's my hot take. I'm just gonna throw it out there in show if Anthony Lynn gets fired in San Diego, sorry, San Diego, LA and Adam gays. It gets like go in New York. Anthony Lynn would be great for that position in New York. I just I think that would be I

Dave Clarke:

thought you're gonna say that they're gonna go and form a crime fighting duo and retired from the NFL. I

Joe Malkin:

mean, they they could but though, we know that Adam gives will get fired from that because Anthony Leno get freaked out by his googly eyes.

Rob Kelly:

They went Listen, listen.

Dave Clarke:

Everybody gets a Netflix show now give us one rate. Why are we so hype on the Jets? What happened?

Rayshawn Buchanan:

definitely wasn't but

Unknown:

I mean, you get four wins. Yeah.

Rayshawn Buchanan:

I mean, that seems like to me No, I mean, I think that, you know, I'm, I felt like that was close to their record last year too. Now granted, I know they had a little more talented, you know? Yeah. Robbie Anderson and some of the guys. I think it was more hype, because they, they were one of the few teams that beat Dallas last year. That was a that was one of their wins. Apparently not that hard to do. It turns out but yeah, pretty much, but, um, you know, yeah, I mean, they they have they've been to some games, though. Honestly, they could have easily gotten to the four wins. You know, I said that, you know, they lost to us in the last minute. They lost the Raiders in the last minute. So, um, you know, that's, that's too much right there today could have been the third had a, you know, so we'll see what they hold on. But, um, yeah, I mean, I don't have to reiterate what Joe said, light Gates has been awful. Yes, he had one playoff appearance in Miami. But, you know, for the most part, he has been subpar his whole coaching career. So there's not really a need for him to be in a head coaching position. Maybe at some point. He could be a coordinator again. Um, but yeah, I agree with you, Joe. I'd like to I think I've become the Anthony Lynn supporter on here. You know, Bobby's kind of killed him in our in our slack chat. Oh, I have to Oh, yeah. I feel like Bobby's killed him more. And I had to come to refresh. Yeah, you know, you know, one of the things I got, I got, like, you know, I just, I just feel like, um, you know, and granted, some decisions have been great, but I do feel like, you know, he'd be good. Up there in New York, for sure. Um, but yeah, I mean, that's, I mean, that's enough on the just, I mean, they're, they're not very good.

Dave Clarke:

Yeah, we've given them we've given them more airtime than they deserve. You're the very, very interesting thing in that division, though, is that you guys did like what? How long has it been since the Patriots lost the afcs? Somebody signed up to 2008 Yeah. 2008. So it's been 12

Rayshawn Buchanan:

it was a tiebreaker with the dolphins.

Dave Clarke:

And you guys actually did predict you got the Patriots record pretty wrong. You're not going to get a point there. But you did predict it to build we're gonna be the division winner which is if you think about it in context of bowl prediction, right

Joe Malkin:

and Cray. Hey, first of all, you know, Craig, Craig and I are playing each other in our fantasy football semi finals and he has been trying to get me to bend the knee for the last 48 hours and I won't go to the board. I won't do it. But what I will tell to reference it right is the fact that Craig and Ray called this at the beginning of the year and had to talk me into it and they had to talk me into the into it go back and listen to that I think that's episode five or six five yeah five of the AMC predictions when when they they basically talked me into buffalo winning the division and they were absolutely right they called it and the records funny that close but but they were right and I went with it because the Patriots weren't looking promising going into the year

Dave Clarke:

it's funny that you you guys talked Joe into the bills winning the division and then proceeded to all talk yourselves into the Patriots winning the division for the entire season. For on every show we were on it was every week was the Patriots. Yeah, no

Joe Malkin:

I get it I totally understand we're not fans of the dinners Rogers and cowboys so we were so well

Dave Clarke:

downtrend uptrend where we've got some trods up we're not on the division yet so be the ya know the P I get it I totally understand the Patriots. It's been a frustrating year Cam Newton can't move the football it's it's upsetting you're not going to get a point on that record. It was the wrong call but you know it's your home team and we are a New England centric podcast so I understand being being big on them while simultaneously trying to be pragmatic and when the the prediction game which is looking good for you guys so the dolphins are average I know Bobby's been talking a lot about them is much maligned power rankings offseason Wait a minute, wait

Michael Marcangelo:

a minute, I'm not even on their motherfucking team and they're not the dolphins are not in five dude, they're not average. The Bears average they're seven seven, right?

Dave Clarke:

The Bears are average. Yeah, they're an average team. The Miami Dolphins. Do you do the dolphins have a playoff shot?

Michael Marcangelo:

Yeah, I mean, I would I would put them

Joe Malkin:

who are we asking the AFC team in the NFC the world?

Unknown:

Anyone does anywhere in

Rayshawn Buchanan:

the world? Is it for the world? No. Um, I do think they do have a shot. I really do. Um, you know, we've talked about you know, I know Joseph fan of like Brian Flores. Um, you know, I'll say that's just the next guy that's or maybe the guy has become the best guy out of Bella scotian tree, at least at the pro level anyways. Um, cuz I know Saban came out of there too, but he's in college. So he was terrible in Miami. But, um, I just think that you know, they, they their discipline for the most part to uh, he's improving by the week in my opinion. And I just felt like if they run the ball close to what they ran to today, I'm especially when I run a game hasn't been that strong but Breda and Sanders can do anything and you get a you get divots a part Yeah, you get Gaskin back and um,

Dave Clarke:

guys can say some injury trouble and he's their best he's their best, right right guy in the right field, you know, so that's going to be tough for them going in. But if

Rayshawn Buchanan:

you get if you get kiseki and you get vontae Parker back and as I said, the SEC is much better than I did, I thought hell calls had a good game to hit us too. So,

Dave Clarke:

I mean, I need to call out I hate to call it everyone's bias here. And you know, I know I do it too, because I was agreeing with Mike that the Green Bay Packers weren't going to have a good year and then Aaron Rodgers just came out through all over us. But every time somebody beats the Patriots, you guys are like, you know, they're they're not half bad.

Rayshawn Buchanan:

We beat them week one, though. I mean, we beat them by week one. I was like, okay,

Dave Clarke:

but we wanted them is it is a lifetime ago, right? You guys

Rayshawn Buchanan:

know what I'm saying? Well, hang on. We saw a lot of stuff go on between week one. So now to say they're a decent team. So that's exactly what

Unknown:

he said. Yes. I

Joe Malkin:

mean, not only not only that, they just they just lost they lost for their top weapons on offense today and still beat the patriots who I mean granted the Patriots defense has been okay. Gilmore went down in the first half. So that kind of sucked and wasn't any help. I don't think the dolphins are there yet. Like I think they can they can get into the playoffs this year. I just don't think they're there to make that run. But if you can keep this squad together and you can keep the core together, they'll get there because I am very high on Brian Flores. I'm not super super high on two. Oh, but he is getting better by the week. Myles Gaskin it has been phenomenal for them to vontae Parker when healthiness right when healthy. I mean he's on the COVID list this time around. So devonte Parker is kind of seeing a resurgence. I think it's great that to has Ryan Fitzpatrick as his backup quarterback. So much has changed since that week one because they've they've been able to get there. And one of the biggest things that Brian Flores said to his team today, and they reported it on CBS during the game was that they had so many guys out because of injury or COVID or whatever else. But you know, they already have the Patriots number in South Beach anyway. So what what he came out and said to his backups were you wouldn't be on this team if I didn't think you could play. And that's and that's just some, I mean, even if it's NFL football players, and they're getting paid hundreds of 1000s of dollars, millions of dollars. It that's such a great way to approach the situation. And especially with a rookie quarterback, three rookie lineman, I mean, that team is just going in the right direction. They're just not there yet.

Michael Marcangelo:

I guess I just have one question, Joe, because you've always been high on Brian Flores. Right? I mean, from from the minute we started this you have Why did you? Were you the only one because you have them at six and 10. But yeah, that was your prediction.

Joe Malkin:

I think I think Ray had them at eight Nate. And I think Craig had them around seven and nine. But I just I think guys where we were was the fact that it just it wasn't there yet because it was Ryan Fitzpatrick a quarterback or a rookie quarterback. And generally a rookie quarterback. That's that's Oh into against Belichick right, generally, not on a on a good day. Because before today, his last loss to a rookie quarterback was in 2013 against Geno Smith. So I mean, the odds were in the Patriots favor. So that was two losses right there for the dolphins. You know, the bills were coming in. Good. So that's at least three, maybe four losses there. So I think it was just a matter of seeing that team progress. And they really have I mean, nine and five now. I just I don't know, it was definitely wrong, but it wasn't the worst pick out of all 32 teams.

Michael Marcangelo:

So we're doing I don't want to throw you off. Dave. I just wanna say one thing. I was watching that game. And once the Patriots lost, I actually jumped up on the from the couch and said, the AFC just lost a point. That's how in my head you guys

Rayshawn Buchanan:

right Murphree baby

Joe Malkin:

who was standing on top of the three children dresses you into they now have a head injury.

Michael Marcangelo:

It was Angela.

Dave Clarke:

Angela always gets the brunt of it. And I will say though that I will say though that Ray, you are not living rent free. If you've ever met Mike, he lets you live in his head. But he's definitely charging. I mean, come on. Let's let's be honest, years, not surprising at all that we died a little bit in the AFC East. But good that we talked that through, we all agreed that the dolphins are average. If we could just move on. We can just move on now to back to the NFC team over to the NFC West. I think we did okay with the Seahawks. They're underperforming a little bit, I think to everybody's expectations as far as winning games goes. And I'm gonna go to Bobby for this one first, because he seems like he's excited and has something to say

Rob Kelly:

no, because Go ahead. So I know I at very beginning of the season, the number one thing about the Seahawks team is it's Russell Wilson will take this team, they honestly and I know that there was a point during the middle of the season where we didn't think this was the case anymore. But that team is DK Metcalf tower wachet Russell Wilson, they don't have anything else. They don't have an offensive line. There's a lot to have are low. So you know but that's but that's literally all they have. Chris Carson is hurt. Carlos Hyde is a shell used to be. I just I just think that the Seahawks aren't as good as what they show. And I really think that it really all relies on Russell Wilson, however,

Michael Marcangelo:

said we are going to get what we said. Yeah, we are going to get the point. We have them at 12. And for their tenant for right now we got the point. I mean, we call that right.

Dave Clarke:

Yeah, but they did but I'm saying they did underperform to our expectations as far as winning games goes. Yeah, we were saying they were gonna be a 12 win team. And they don't know. Oh, well I don't know who they have left to play. But I think that I think that on the eye test as Bobby likes to famously say, I think that they haven't looked as good as a unit as we thought they were going to look I think as of last year at this time regular season last year, they were looking at they might potentially be super bowl winners, you know, with the points that they were putting up with the way Russell Wilson was playing i think that that hype has diminished a little bit and I think that that's a fair a fair assessment of because they're not really in your head now the NFC in general is not really in your head as far as somebody went in the Superbowl you know what I mean? Especially with you know how the Chiefs look with the Steelers going on that run maybe the saints but I you know I didn't I only left the the saints chiefs game as it was going on. It looks like the Chiefs were just going to have their way so I'm not sure how it's going right now but that the Seahawks are not really in your head as a potential Super Bowl winner. Am I correct about that? And I think they weren't they might have been at the start of the season.

Michael Marcangelo:

I think the one thing that's changed though is like before, like their defense used to have some regard for them, right? their defense is a lot worse than we thought it was going to be but I think that their offense is exponentially better than we thought it was going to be right so now it's not a matter of the Seahawks and stop you now it's they can actually keep up with you and you need to stop them can you so I think the whole dynamic changed a little bit.

Dave Clarke:

That's fair, I think um, yeah, the the 40 Niners I tried to tell I know it's crazy you're gonna agree with all over the place. I tried to tell you guys before you guys weren't gonna be good. I did try and tell you I came in pretty down on them. We gave them a tenant six wildcard berth.

Michael Marcangelo:

Well, Bobby,

Rob Kelly:

this is his tournament. Yeah, no, that was all there. Yeah, I just I just really want Kyle Shanahan and I still think that this team would have had a much different season have they stayed healthy they

Joe Malkin:

stayed healthy he

Rob Kelly:

stayed healthy

Rayshawn Buchanan:

didn't what I'm doing it What do you know? We were saying it the whole time he

Rob Kelly:

did it but he didn't did he know and now they suck they're five and nine

Rayshawn Buchanan:

yeah Bobby we had all the field

Rob Kelly:

right but he's not on the field is my point. He is not on this record right. But what is the record so this is this is the exact conversation I'm talking about? Is it the 40 Niners yes they're great when Jimmy's on the field but guess what? He's fucking not he never is in there five or none?

Dave Clarke:

Yes, but I think what their point was if I could try and sift through the the yelling at you, is that they they said that gvg can't seem to same stay healthy. So it's a difficult bet to bet on the 40 Niners now they're talking to me shitting on Jimmy g cuz

Rob Kelly:

he can never stay healthy.

Unknown:

No, right.

Michael Marcangelo:

What were the right thing?

Dave Clarke:

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. So so they were saying it's it's difficult for me to stay healthy. And you have been very high on Jimmy Garoppolo in the past, but also it's just you have contradicted yourself about Jimmy Garoppolo a little bit and i think that i think that i understand where they're coming from a little you know, made us predict that this that the 49 is we're going to have a winning season because of him. It was more because Kyle Shanahan and the running game that's why I think the 49 is a good I've heard the words gbg come out of your mouth more times this season than any other phrase I find it

Rob Kelly:

hard not true that is I find me well

Dave Clarke:

other than the Cowboys the Cowboys but I find it hard to believe that you didn't factor him in to your take that they were Bobby

Michael Marcangelo:

if you go back and listen to the prediction show you said like his his next full year and the Kyle Shanahan offense after Super Bowl he's gonna be that much better this team's gonna run away with that division that's

Joe Malkin:

so strange.

Rayshawn Buchanan:

I wonder why because he's what he's been on it for. So when he got there in 2017

Michael Marcangelo:

they had to see this coming

Rayshawn Buchanan:

five days right but okay,

Rob Kelly:

but you got to think about it he's not allowed to change my opinion on someone based off the fact that again, he got hurt for the third at a four year way are

Dave Clarke:

you changing your opinion? Are you saying that he's not good? He's not reliable. I

Rob Kelly:

think he is good. I just think He always gets hurt and I just don't bite off and it's just not someone you can bank a franchise

Dave Clarke:

but if he's Yeah, but that that means he's not good then

Rayshawn Buchanan:

unless he's in Dallas.

Rob Kelly:

That means you don't want Jimmy g in Dallas cuz I don't want another hurt quarterback every year. I've been through that with Tony Romo. I think Tony Romo was amazing but he could never fucking stay healthy and guess what? I never want a Super Bowl So there we are.

Joe Malkin:

Well, yeah, you never want a Super Bowl cuz you're not on the team.

Rob Kelly:

Well the pump was never won a Super Bowl. You know what I'm fucking saying.

Joe Malkin:

We're just getting your your wound up. But the first thing you said I this is the last thing on the 40 notes. The first thing you said when we said when who stays healthy. You said Jimmy g but guess who's also been hurt all season. Raheem mostert has been hurt on and off all season. So you didn't say most at first, but you said that it's Kyle Shanahan and the running game. But Kyle Shanahan is a quarterback guru. He actually is unlike Adam gays. Kyle Shanahan can actually make quarterbacks good. And as Mike's been saying all season long, he thinks he can get it done with Mullins. bethard. Jimmy G, it doesn't matter. So exactly why you thought the 40 Niners were gonna be good this year is exactly why Ray, Shawn and I and Mike and I more than rayshawn would ride the Jimmy g train into the sunset in New England,

Rob Kelly:

just to just ride them to

Michael Marcangelo:

our just a book and this this is one of the only arguments where like, you guys are actually both Right. Right. So so we're all saying that the me That's right, but the 49 is are better with Jimmy G and then go to the Super Bowl unless it's the trivia show and yours saying,

Rayshawn Buchanan:

Ah, okay. All right. Here we go.

Dave Clarke:

All right. So point being and I think I think we can all agree that the most important point to take from this conversation is that I tried to tell Bobby, the 49 weren't going to be good. And they weren't. Right. And Bobby was wrong. So moving on to the rest of that division, the Cardinals? I mean,

Michael Marcangelo:

I think you were down on the Cardinals do DK I will say this you It's true. It's true. It's true that you were four and 12, or five and 11. And Bobby and I were a little higher than that. I think we both were at 10 and six, which

Dave Clarke:

we came all the way in six, which is still possible for that. Yeah, they're they're hanging on to the third wildcard spot in the NFC right now and could get picked for that not make the playoffs? I think that, um, I was down on Kyler getting figured out I think was my point I thought he was gonna get figured out this year. I don't know if that's what happened. I think that he got a little bit of a sophomore slump type, middle of the season. And this is sort of come back I think, and I think that you put through I

Michael Marcangelo:

think they could maybe if they figured him out that was like pre hot. I don't think that's what happened. I don't think Yep, yeah, but that was pre DeAndre Hopkins that's relitigation point right? Like this is this is out of that. So there's

Dave Clarke:

also what I the I've changed my mind on on Kyler in general, because to see a young quarterback struggle over the course of a number of weeks and then come back from that and and start getting his game back. And I think that is it is a sign of, you know, very Bob Kelly hype man championship DNA type rant, which I'm not all in on him yet, but I think I have more faith in him. I just thought it was too small. I was just looking at prototypical QB size. I was like, I just, it'd be a nice story. But I mean, how do you play at that size? You know what I mean? He's proven me wrong on that. I don't think size is a factor. And to come back from some game tape being developed on you and to change your game like that. Yes. He's thrown it down to Hopkins. Obviously, that's a big deal. But you can't negate his improvement because of having a good weapon. Like that's just it is what it is. And I and I, I'm a little happier with the Cardinals. I think I'd be more hype on them going into next season than I was this season.

Michael Marcangelo:

Yeah, I mean, I think I think this is this isn't the ceiling for the Cardinals. I think they can go a lot higher than this. I think their defense needs to get a little bit better. But Hopkins is he's a game changer, dude. I mean, he made Matt Shaab look like an actual quarterback for years. Think about that. That's what Andre Hopkins does for somebody. And when you have someone with with as much talent as as Kyler Murray, I mean, he's gonna be the Binky that we always wanted here that we never had here that will make you that much better. Yeah, good luck.

Rob Kelly:

The only thing I think that could hold this team back is Kliff Kingsbury. I just think sometimes as a coach he does struggle to adapt and into in game situations as my camera goes off, so I guess he struggles to adapt to in game situations and just can't adjust on the run. Which is why I think when you see Kyler get shut down and he can't be the same Kyler Murray that we are all used to. Or that we've all been seeing so far this season. They really struggle like they did too bad. It's like they did against all these teams you stop Kyler and don't let him be Kyler

Dave Clarke:

Murray Fitz face it's you bet that Larry fits in in his generation. We're just off you know, like they just didn't match up because I think that with multiple weapons like that, I think Kyler Murray could be special but I think we're gonna skip the Rams just because we're kind of running out of time. Real quick, we're

Unknown:

all wrong.

Michael Marcangelo:

We were all wrong. Sure.

Joe Malkin:

Yeah. Real quick on the Cardinals. Just real quick. I just to rebut Bobby, I think you're right about cliffs, Kliff, Kingsbury, but I think if you give him time and give him a little bit of time in that organization, they're going to be all right. The best thing for Kliff Kingsbury. Kyler Murray and DeAndre Hopkins is the fact that Larry Fitzgerald is still there to have that kind of a guy still there to be that kind of a mentor, and Hopkins kind of having that humbling trade from Houston. I know he didn't really like Bill O'Brien either, but there's some good Coaches on that on that Arizona side I mean they have Jim Dre who's been around for a long time they advanced Joseph as a defensive coordinator. That team is going to be just fine in the West that that division is going to be really good for the next five years.

Dave Clarke:

Yeah, all right. Well that does it for them. I do agree with that. In fact, we were wrong about the Rams they're better than we thought but I still don't think they're good enough to be really worth any kind of conversation. I know you guys were hyped on the method beat the past but everybody beats the past now sorry. So well that you but then you know, if you're gonna do that math, the Jets, RAMs,

Unknown:

the Cardinals

Joe Malkin:

might as well just give the Jets the Lombardi Trophy then moving on. So

Dave Clarke:

the AFC next week, the AFC West. I think that was a foregone conclusion. And it looks like you guys pretty much nailed it. From what I'm looking at. You called 14 two for the chiefs, which is still definitely on the table. You got the Raiders, right? Because they have a very, very bad coach. And I think that was your guys's point, right? You were saying that Jon Gruden is not good, you're

Unknown:

wrong. It was yours.

Dave Clarke:

Oh, okay. Well, somebody smart said it's so. So they're 77 now, they're seven and seven, potentially seven and eight. I didn't check the score today's game. They're not. They're probably going to go eight and eight. You probably nailed that right on the nose. The Chargers are six, as you called six and 10 and another five and nine. You're right on there. They're very boring and nothing to talk about there so much. And the Broncos. I can't think of any interesting storylines that's going on with them. I think Gordon's underperformed on the season I think that they have a lot of work to do they need to strip things down but

Rayshawn Buchanan:

a lot of injuries though, I feel like

Joe Malkin:

yeah, they did they did tire quarterback room.

Rayshawn Buchanan:

Even but even before that, no,

Unknown:

not that anyone

Rayshawn Buchanan:

was out early in the year. So I mean, they Yeah, they just wasn't they were devoid of any weapons. They were gonna really come into the scene. You know? So

Dave Clarke:

I think I think the interesting narrative about the military talk to talk to me about the the Kansas City Chiefs, I think that they're still as good as we thought they were but they have had their hands full a little bit more with other teams. So like, what do you guys think? What did you guys think at the start of the season, you gave them a 14 and two record? And what do you think now?

Rayshawn Buchanan:

Do you i think i think i was a little I was a little more bullish than Jove and Craig, I'm fat. I'm pretty sure I said 16 No. So 16 or 15. And one I was I was pretty I, um, mainly because I just know that when it comes to the offense, like they're, they need 40 they can get 40 they need to get 31 to get 31 they need 21 to your 18 is going to get 21 right so they just make the plays whenever they need to now has a social vulnerability defensively. Yes, because when you give up 42 Las Vegas, you can vote 31 to Carolina, um, you know, you can score on them. However, are you going to be able to make enough plays offensively? I try I've never gonna play defensively. ticketaim them because ball control as we learned is not the answer. Yes, it worked into 28 2019 AFC Championship game when we beat them up there. But the Bob Barker show does not work with the seem like you have to keep scoring so we don't keep going they're going to find a way to score and a score and quick fast in a hurry just actually used in Texas last year.

Joe Malkin:

So it could also be their kryptonite, though Ray just just a button there that could be we've seen it before because defenses they can't hold up in the in the playoffs are the ones that get beaten and now their defense was not as good in my opinion. Their defense wasn't as good last year as it is this year. Right on on paper as Mike likes to say. But But I think that that I mean, and then they still want a Super Bowl. I mean, Tyree kill has 17 total touchdowns he has 15 receiving touchdowns and two on the ground. I mean, the dude, the dudes crazy and they have Travis Kelsey. And when when Robinson Watkins and Hardman are healthy

Rayshawn Buchanan:

that is Yeah, it's a joke. Like, it's a joke. how good they are like, and we you know, we compared him at times to the greatest show on turf on that offense, but I don't know maybe cuz I'm in the moment, but they they could be better than that than that offense, man. Like, it's crazy how good they are. And the homeless is unreal. I know, Craig throws otherwise I know, crazy things. He's going to be out of the league in a matter of, you know, three or four years, you know,

Unknown:

I know.

Rayshawn Buchanan:

Okay. Yeah, I mean, the fact that that's definitive is just wildly you know, smart to say stuff like that, Craig, but it's like, it's crazy, but Welcome to the Dangerous Minds podcast, you know. Craig D'Alessandro? No, but um, yeah, I listened. The chiefs are phenomenal and like that we got everything else just about right. Um, I just agree about not just

Michael Marcangelo:

about Dude, you guys want that division every point?

Rayshawn Buchanan:

Yeah, so next.

Dave Clarke:

Getting right still only counts for one point, unfortunately, maybe next year we'll do if you nail the whole division, you get a bonus but we didn't do that for this and I'm not going back and changing it cuz I'm on the other team. So moving right along to what I would call the most controversial division calls that that really became Through line and an argument throughout the entirety of the season, the trivia shows the band shows we were given my shit first cowboys prediction. Shockingly, if you look at it on paper, we're not that far off in the NFC North guys. I mean, the bears continue

Michael Marcangelo:

lions, right?

Dave Clarke:

I was referencing lines. We're definitely not going to get the Packers. That's fine. But we could still potentially get the point for the other three teams in the NFC north, a stick that you've been being beat with by us, and not even the other team. We were even your shit about this.

Joe Malkin:

Well, David, Tommy, you guys have wanted to like Bobby wanted to jump ship before the prediction show was over. And I wanted to jump ship about halfway through the season. I

Dave Clarke:

never I never want I don't know what's going on over there. I don't accept that at all. I always I always ride or die with. Yeah, let me ask you this.

Rob Kelly:

You already jumped ship? No, I

Dave Clarke:

didn't. Let me ask you this. Let me ask you this. The NFC north, the bears, the lions, the Vikings, the Packers. We're going to exclude the Packers from this because it's pretty cut and dry. Aaron Rodgers had a season that you and I didn't expect them to have. Yeah, the bears past couple games looking a little bit better. They're looking a little bit better. It looks like your Penske can make some plays. Chuck pagano has got that defense taken over a little bit. They haven't played anybody that could but they could still potentially have a nine seven record we can hit the nail on the head there. Yeah, that's pretty good. Yeah, they beat the bucks. The bucks are actually turns out not that good. We'll get to that later. The Tampa Bay Buccaneers? I don't think that I don't think that they're that good. I mean, they barely they barely beat the Falcons today, right? Different division doesn't matter. So a

Michael Marcangelo:

lot, a lot to unpack there. But just keep going. Yeah.

Dave Clarke:

When we get to the NFC South, so yeah, the bears have been a couple decent teams, but they've had a pretty easy schedule. But point being they might, they might nail the record that we gave them. What's up with the NFC north. did it turn out like we predicted go?

Michael Marcangelo:

I let me just say that I think the one thing that I that I couldn't count on like you said, but we can include exclude them is is the is Aaron Rodgers and the Packers. I think I think we I called you and I bolted, Dave because Rob Bobby was high on them for some reason. The Vikings being a fraudulent team. We both had them like six and 10.

Dave Clarke:

Invite the Vikings remember that right? Yeah, the Vikings? Yeah,

Michael Marcangelo:

we both knew they weren't gonna be good. Yeah, they're just like Kirk Cousins has just sackless and and there were some injuries this year, let's fine. So we had them at eight Nate, then they're probably gonna finish that on the lions. I think if I could have amended my my pick, I would have said that they were gonna go nine and seven, and have their coach fired midway through the year that would have been dead. Right. But they're, they're a talented team. And I think that I think the talent is is kind of showing that I mean, they're they're five and nine right now. We have them at nine and seven. So they're going to get to seven and nine. That's that's my hope. I hope to get the point. But the bears man, that that big dick, Nick. He's not selling anything in Chicago right now.

Dave Clarke:

I think it was difficult to I think it was difficult to immediately redesign an offense against around a quarterback that was completely different than Mr. bubinski. And I think that that's what we saw there. They couldn't call plays for Nick foles it just it just wasn't working. But Bobby, what do you think NFC North?

Rob Kelly:

I just think it's blasphemy to me that somehow Mike's Lyons prediction is actually going to get a fucking point from this like it could. It's very possible we're going to and I just think that's the craziest thing. And I just all season long. I couldn't believe that this was the thing that like we had the lions down all season. And if that

Dave Clarke:

season, Mike has been saying that his Packers pic was actually a worse prediction. Yeah. And it turns out to be on paper that turns out to be true. Yeah, so it was

Rob Kelly:

Packers at six and 10. I can't believe that.

Joe Malkin:

That's where you jumped? I can't Yeah,

Rob Kelly:

I can't believe that that happened. And it

Dave Clarke:

was talked into that.

Rayshawn Buchanan:

Right. But I usually call it out Mike for that. But I was like, Oh, you froze like, it's gonna go Gray was

Dave Clarke:

like Aaron Rodgers just

Rayshawn Buchanan:

because you're a Bears fan, but I was like, really? Mike? Like, seriously, like, I understand. That's kind of what actually, I actually

Unknown:

texted me.

Michael Marcangelo:

He actually texted me when you heard the show drop. And he's like, dude, did you really say that shit about Rogers and Packers going

Joe Malkin:

on? Like most of my parents. Apparently you guys have like landline phone conversations that we don't know about. Like you guys say that. Me and Craig have have secret meetings. The two of you. Ray comes on here one days ago. Yeah. I was on the phone with Mike and

Unknown:

Mike. What?

Joe Malkin:

What are you guys? Somebody called me? God didn't know.

Rayshawn Buchanan:

It was about a burger.

Joe Malkin:

Right? Mike? This is where I'm gonna I'm gonna defend Mike on the line speak because from honestly of the five of us, I think I've been the hardest on mic on the lions pick this year because I can take it one. No, no, we know you can take it but this is where I'm gonna turn it around and say listen, Kay, if if Kenny got Yeah, right. Okay, so if Kenny golladay were healthy and they had a half competent coach going into the season. That seems pretty good. I mean, that's pretty good. So

Michael Marcangelo:

I mean, just maybe I don't want to beat a dead horse. But maybe Jamie Collins doesn't punch a fucking rap. Free maybe that

Rob Kelly:

doesn't happen week one week one that happens it just was not looking good for you but

Dave Clarke:

going into the NFL NFL season Matt Patricia was the coach of the Detroit Lions and that's why that was not a good call at the time

Rayshawn Buchanan:

exactly enough he's

Dave Clarke:

not a good coach and that's why he's unemployed I feel for him but I'm sure he's got plenty of money in the bank. So moving on, AFC North. Oh, Bobby, Oh, I got a bone to pick with you now that we're at the AFC North, the Pittsburgh Steelers, which Bobby I don't know if you guys have seen it, but you know, it's got a lot of traction on the Insta. The real big real bks maybe phony BK is power rankings were apparently I don't know he was huffing nitrus before he made the last top 10 until and apparently the Steelers are the seventh best team in the NFL. You the AFC I know I shouldn't be arguing with an NFC participant that the AFC is prediction. But the AFC team called the Steelers attendance six, which was a decently respectable record. And right now they're 11 and two about to go in and probably be 12 and two, when they destroyed the Cincinnati Bengals on Monday, who have won what one or two, maybe two games so far, they're terrible. Get them in this division. The Ravens are not nearly as good as you guys thought. It doesn't look like you're gonna get that point. Actually, you're you're mathematically eliminated from getting that point.

Rayshawn Buchanan:

way. So what do we have?

Dave Clarke:

You had this ravens at 13 and three your height? Okay,

Rayshawn Buchanan:

so they're not they're not at five right? yet? No, 11 511, two, five, we get the point, actually.

Dave Clarke:

Or you could say you could potentially still get the point doesn't look good.

Rayshawn Buchanan:

It just it but but I was I was the one that was like, I'll take I'll take the blame Joe, you know, I'll put me on French string. And I thought Lamar was gonna be sensational. And at times, he wasn't sure. But it's time he's taken a major step back. He's given me major, you know, major shift for that. That's cool. I could take it just I hate to take it, but it's all good. Um,

Unknown:

I can't I don't want anyone to give me shit.

Rayshawn Buchanan:

Yeah. Well, as we got plenty out there, but it's just like, um, well, I mean, he came back and he took one on a brown suit. So that's exactly what happened. So

Rob Kelly:

so many references in there.

Rayshawn Buchanan:

Yeah, it's Yeah, exactly.

Dave Clarke:

So tell me, tell me, how does that. How did you see that division going into this season? And how does it stack up to what you expected?

Rayshawn Buchanan:

Well, I'll say, Joe, Joe is going to cosign for sir when I say this, but I think that, um, I don't even think that we picked Pittsburgh at all. I think during the show, if I'm not mistaken, like at all, we just say no, we said nothing.

Joe Malkin:

I lobbied for that after the fact because

Rayshawn Buchanan:

it was unbelievable. Well, Mike,

Dave Clarke:

do you think that Bobby's rankings if they add to having them at seventh is correct? Or are the Pittsburgh Steelers a legitimately good football team?

Rayshawn Buchanan:

No, I disagree. He knows. So listen.

Dave Clarke:

And are they better than you thought they are? Are they better than Bobby thinks they are now? And are they better than then you thought that they were going to be going into the season? That was a

Joe Malkin:

yes. And yes,

Rayshawn Buchanan:

yes. And yes, it is. Okay,

Joe Malkin:

I want to Oh, hang on. I want to take that for a second. Because the other day in our Slack, Bobby, Bobby comes up with this and says, Hey, you know, Ben Roethlisberger looks 38 that's because he's friggin 38. Right? They can't run the football game. James Connor had COVID Yeah, but you can't.

Rob Kelly:

What happened to showing up no matter what happened. COVID not being an excuse what happened to just playing football and being able to do your game,

Joe Malkin:

because we didn't make COVID make the rules because we didn't make the rules. I didn't suspend them the or put them on the COVID list that the Steelers did the league did. So you can't say they can't run the ball. But when they ran the ball on the ball of their professional football team, when they ran the ball for 10 weeks, and then he comes down with COVID and is told not to play by rule in the league. It's not the fact that he did or they got on, we can cam the whole time about how cam should play better cam should be better cam should look better. And he didn't. And that's because he wasn't healthy, whether it was a shoulder thing or something else, but we're not using it as an excuse. We're using it as a reason but you're saying they can't run the football but they did it for 10 weeks. So then they come out for one week. And now they know in fairness

Dave Clarke:

they didn't they didn't really they didn't really they didn't really

Rob Kelly:

know they've looked like shit

Unknown:

or not great.

Rob Kelly:

cowboys and then loss of the football team almost losing

Joe Malkin:

your boys are not as bad as you think your cowboys are and we've been trying to tell you that all season long. And I and I understand you want them to be bad. I get that you're just that's just the kind of fan you are and that's fine. And I'm starting to come to terms with that. But but then you also you also brought up the fact that the receivers, the receivers drop the keep dropping passes. Bobby, you're so short sighted on this. You are so short sighted on this because Ben Roethlisberger has had the best season he's had because they've won 11 games Bobby because they were eight and eight without Ben and they're 11 and what happened?

Rob Kelly:

Whatever happened to you guys loving teams going into the playoffs hot right Don't wait, I think they're gonna win this week and then they're going to lose to the Colts and they're going to lose to the browns and I don't think that there's much question in my head about that. The Colts are great and we get a point ball team then the Steelers are right now, the Browns are a better looking football.

Dave Clarke:

That is the stupidest fucking Rams. The Browns are better.

Unknown:

They are a better looking football screen.

Dave Clarke:

Don't scream Don't scream doesn't Calm yourself. Second of all, second of all,

Michael Marcangelo:

the Barrett

Dave Clarke:

Cleveland Browns there are better.

Michael Marcangelo:

There are bad elevens and to to bad. dk, we said it last year, all of a sudden, the Patriots were really bad ain't no team. They are not but you're not

Dave Clarke:

keeping that same energy with

Michael Marcangelo:

the Steelers.

Dave Clarke:

You're not you're not keeping that same energy with the kids. They've had all close games also. But apparently,

Michael Marcangelo:

their generational offense Steelers had the second easiest record in schedule in the league. You

Dave Clarke:

can't beat any time with that stick you play who's in front of you. That's an absurd thing to say loss of the

Joe Malkin:

Patriots. The Patriots had the 32nd ranked strength of schedule and we're playing in one of the worst divisions in football for the last 12 years. I and granted we only started this podcast in August, but from what I can remember whether it was Facebook or anything else, you you never got on them for that you never get in fact you were in their camp for that same reason. Because in 2014 when they were two and two, and I counted them out you were like oh, well they have they have an easy when

Dave Clarke:

they finish that you're 11 and five they won the Superbowl. Yeah, but once you finish that year 11 and five so before five and four Yeah, exactly. They

Joe Malkin:

only lost two more games after that. So you're so the Steelers can still finish 14 and two, then we wouldn't have the point that Yeah, they could still finish Bobby we're playing if games would you love to play? They can still finish 14 and 230 you guys three and a half game when that division

Unknown:

duel You started it?

Joe Malkin:

They right now they want this this is the if that I'll play they can right now. still get the bye week in the first round. They probably won't, but they still can, which means that they would still be the best team in the AFC regardless of if their record is weak or not. They would still be the best team they actually had one week and it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter what their schedule is. There's 30

Michael Marcangelo:

that's what that's what you meant though because their record can't be let me just say this.

Dave Clarke:

Let me just say this. Let me just say this and I agree with Joe take away the regular season for a second it historically the the Pittsburgh Steelers were wildcard seen the first time they want us to bowl in our lifetime right there are 11 and five they have a proven winner at quarterback that is the biggest factor in winning a Super Bowl in the NFL is to have a proven winner or a potentially proven winner at quarterback if you have a loser Hold on a second Mike hold yourself hold yourself back for one second let me just do this the the the Pittsburgh Steelers have a two time champion a bit in Ben Roethlisberger. They have yes like Bobby says they have a lot of drops. That's not the quarterbacks fault one going into the playoffs? No, no, he's right. They do have the second that they're tied for most drops in the NFL, which I didn't realize and he did get me with that in the slack. I got given credit for that. I didn't realize that and I had to regroup and re research when he said that to me. But the because it has an eye on the eye test it hasn't looked like that it's looked like they're wide receivers are as good as they are on paper to me when I watch them. But they they have a defense that's full of injuries and their schedules not not because of them not because of their COVID restrictions because of other teams COVID restrictions, their their schedules been getting tossed up and down the week. Okay, so then they lose two games right after that happens. Yes, they lose to the Washington football team. But how are you going to beat him with that stick when you spent 10 minutes on this show today? fellating the Washington football team for how good day?

Michael Marcangelo:

I said. So let's expel your narrative there I five and 1103 and 13. Remember, I'm the one that told you that Ben Roethlisberger was better than Peyton Manning back in 2011. You told me that you're gonna leave the show. So like you can't have it both ways. You can't say he's an experienced winner.

Dave Clarke:

That's a different different story. Of course Peyton Manning is better than Ben Roethlisberger. That's an absurd statement. That's that doesn't mean Ben Ross was not good.

Rob Kelly:

I just I just I just don't see it. Because like, if, okay, if one seed, I would consider them possibly they could make a run. But listen, they're not getting any healthier. You know what I mean? They have the toughest three games. They're in the after tomorrow. today, tomorrow. Tomorrow. After tomorrow, they have the toughest two games coming up on their entire schedule and then they have to go into the playoffs raise that and they don't even get a bye week because they're not going to get it the chiefs are gonna get that by all right.

Dave Clarke:

I appreciate the passion. The last say on it. The last thing I'll say on it, is that you drop them five places in your power rankings for losing to the bills and the bills. You put it number two how Can the number two team in the NFL according to you beating another team drop them five or six places How does that make sense? The bills

Rob Kelly:

it should be fine because they were the second

Dave Clarke:

best team in the NFL according to you

Rob Kelly:

that entire first half they were dominating the bills were dominated

Dave Clarke:

that they

Rob Kelly:

paid six and then they got absolutely smoke

Dave Clarke:

a second best team that just said they dominated you just said that they dominated a build your own power recall

Rob Kelly:

guys right guys there's 60 minutes in a football game not 30 yet

Dave Clarke:

watching it with you would probably see my fucking longer Bobby

Rob Kelly:

60 did they do that? No.

Dave Clarke:

Don't worry folks at home we totally still like each other pistols at dawn. I don't. Okay, moving on. Because we're behind schedule here. We're moving on because we're behind schedule here. So we got a power through the rest. Moving on to the AFC to the NFC South. So wait, I'm fine. I'm totally fine. I know how fucking wrong you are. So I'm good. So NFC South. We're gonna power through this really fast. You said that the book? The Panthers are bad. turns out they're bad. That was correct. The Falcons are average. Turns out they were below average. That was essentially correct. I was hyped on the saints being good. turns out they're pretty decent despite their their issues at quarterback. I think I thought the Buccaneers are going to be better than they are. So I'm going to go to Mike on the Buccaneers. And then I'm gonna go Bobby on the seats. Mike, what

Michael Marcangelo:

do you got to say about the Buccaneers we had the Buccaneers at 12 and four there, they're probably going to finish it at 11 and five so I don't think that we were that we were off I think that we all agree that it was gonna take some time for all those pieces to kind of mesh. I didn't think there was gonna be as much friction on from you know, between ariens and Brady as there has been throughout the season. But I still think that talent in that on that team is gonna is gonna bring them to 11 and five, so I don't feel too bad about that.

Dave Clarke:

I know you said earlier there was a lot to unpack on this. I don't think

Michael Marcangelo:

they were bad. You said that they were

Dave Clarke:

no i don't i don't think that they're bad. I just think that they're worse than I thought they're going to be I shouldn't have phrased it like that. I think there were some I thought they're gonna be with Tom Brady a quarterback. I think that they look like a team that could be really good next season, but I'm not sure how many years Tom Brady has left but you know, doubting him on that has proven I just don't I mean, I

Michael Marcangelo:

just think like one of the things that we talked about earlier in the years that Brady never had to worry about things outside of like where his receivers are supposed to be like he had a coach that always knew where his DVD where everything else is going to be ariens isn't like that dude, he's a he's kind of a he kind of like a loose guy. I think they've kind of figured it out now. I think that you know gronk is kind of looking like gronk did before he retired i mean he's looking pretty good now he looked awful the first five years of the year so if you got if you have a healthy gronk pretty good pretty healthy Tom Brady 11 and five that's that's that's a pretty good record.

Dave Clarke:

Person percent chance that Tom Brady has a recording a seven Super Bowl this season.

Michael Marcangelo:

I mean 15 My dream was it was gonna be pages versus the bucks in the Bucs stadium that now happened now now I'm rooting for him. I want to I want to win seven i think that that just makes everything that we do here on missing the point that much juicy or if he wins on without bill so I'm on the tippy top bandwagon.

Dave Clarke:

All right, Bobby, talk to me about the New Orleans Saints what's going on over there?

Rob Kelly:

I love the saints right now I know that they have either you know we you guys we talked about diversity a lot. injuries, things like that. When teams actually succeed with these injuries like so the saints have injuries up and down their entire roster Michael Thomas has barely played this year. Emmanuel Sanders has been out Drew Brees is out taysom Hill and guess what they're still the number one seed or number two seed in the NFC now, Packers number one, the number two seed in the NFC and they haven't

Dave Clarke:

finished is the number one seed though.

Rob Kelly:

It looks they haven't had one week with their full team, not one. And that's even including this week against the Chiefs Michael Thomas is out into the playoffs. So I don't know if it's gonna be something that like maybe they won't ever get that chemistry that they need going forward. But the fact that they're where they are right now to me is just unbelievable. We had him at 11 and five or 10 three at the moment not sure how this chiefs game is gonna shake out. But that picks definitely looking pretty good for us.

Dave Clarke:

Yeah, the seats are definitely good and adversity like I said is is a good thru line and I appreciate that and I think that there's one of the two teams that you could fear coming out of the AFC I think it's them in the Packers I don't think it's anybody else

Rayshawn Buchanan:

that could I ask that question DK host please sir,

Unknown:

please Okay. Hey, Bobby,

Rayshawn Buchanan:

hey friend. Hey buddy. Go ahead. I'm so I'm sorry.

Rob Kelly:

Excess through adversity

Rayshawn Buchanan:

is gonna say before you say anything championship DNA, right. That's right, baby. Um, I did notice things had much Sorry. I'm

Dave Clarke:

Ray we're behind schedule. Get to the fucking point.

Rayshawn Buchanan:

Okay. Sorry. I missed the point sometimes. Sorry. So, Bobby, so what's the confidence that you where's the coffee? Why is it so much confidence In the saints, but not in Pittsburgh, because they have exactly

Rob Kelly:

what I just said success through adversity. You know what I mean? The saints have had this adversity and they are now the number two seed in the NFC and they continue to win games. The Steelers have gone through adversity and have now dropped two out of three in the last four weeks have looked like shit.

Michael Marcangelo:

I mean, all right. One of their wins was against the Broncos who didn't have a quarterback like at all on the roster.

Unknown:

You know what I mean? Like

Joe Malkin:

I agree and disagree with you Bobby it because I really liked the saints. I don't know if you saw me nodding my head the whole time. Like, I really liked the saints. And it's partially because they're ahead of the Buccaneers. And that story is really helping my narrative because to Mike's point real quick just to glaze over those two teams. If Tom Brady doesn't have a buy, he's not gonna win a Super Bowl. He's got to get that week off. I still he hasn't been beat up all their rest that old, those old bones because Tampa Tampa has actually put a pretty good offensive line in front of them. He's had a good season because of it. I think he expected to be better than he is. I think there is already a rift with the head coach there. So I don't think the Buccaneers even get to the NFC Championship game, not to mention the winner Super Bowl. I really liked the saints. I think I think Bobby's right in that sense that they have been pretty much seamless in most of their trials and tribulations here. I think that one thing where I will agree with you on the running game Bobby is that Alvin Kamara is a head and shoulders better running back than James Connor. I think James Connor is a very good running back. I think Alvin Kamara is more versatile. I think he's a better overall football player. But he has been the constant in that offense. Right. So so so they've had that constant. So I think if you look at all the teams that have faced the adversity and not done very well, they've probably lost that piece. Because unlike a lot of people, especially in this Boston Market, and fans think that running backs are not that important. The Boston Market. Boston Market is pretty good. I haven't had a lot of time, not a sponsor, but running backs are a very important part of the game. And I think that's another reason why Tampa has been successful because Tampa has at times not had wide receivers, but they do have two very good running backs. Now they don't have Ronald Jones because not only is he on the IR but he's also on the COVID list because he broke his Pinky, and was in close contact with somebody who had a COVID but having Leonard fournette I

Dave Clarke:

thought he was in close contact with somebody who broke his Pinkie. But oh, no, sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Moving on, moving on. Sorry to cut you off, Joe. But I do want to talk about the AFC south for a second because you guys nailed the AFC south to your predictions seemed actually borderline ridiculous. I mean, no, they put I mean two of the teams, right? So they said that the Titans and the Colts are gonna be nine and seven. And both of those teams are nine and four. Right?

Michael Marcangelo:

Well, there's also the Texas would be 97 as well.

Joe Malkin:

Well, that was also because that's what they always do. But that was a casualty of our lobbying to get the Steelers into the playoffs. And

Dave Clarke:

I think everybody thought that the time that Texans were going to be a little bit better than they were this season, I did not expect them to self destruct the way that they have. And I think the lions on

Joe Malkin:

the AFC Well, I

Dave Clarke:

because they have deshaun Watson who I think is like, you know, genuinely a generational quarterback and I think he's having a good am having a good season despite his team having a bad season is is testament to what maybe he could have done if they didn't trade the best wide receiver in the NFL to the Cardinals for no reason. Well, I don't think it was just a head coach. But so yeah, yeah, no, totally, totally. Totally. Totally. And I think that they still have personnel and i and i think that looking at that team on paper wasn't a terrible call to call them nine and seven. But the Titans nine and seven and the call sign seven could still potentially happen I'm pretty sure and that like that looks like on the table who cares about the Jaguars because they're just bad and you said they're gonna be bad and that's no surprise there. But talk to me about the the Titans in the Colts their their perennial middle of the Packers in the AFC they haven't been talked about a ton. But they both have talented players on their team. The Colts have a veteran quarterback who hasn't wanted anything yet, but I mean, maybe squeak something. And what do you guys think about those two teams to re talk to me about the Titans? Yeah,

Rayshawn Buchanan:

I mean, obviously, you know, I'm, you know, I'm team Henry over here. You know, we had a we had an argument, it's so fun to watch. Yeah, he's a beast, you know, you know, talking about a man, he's a man. And I felt like, you know, we had an argument three weeks ago about you know, running backs on being so important. And I'm just like, Whoa, this guy's a beast, so you can't when we're running backs being your best player, kind of like our point guard argument, but we're gonna attend a few seconds. Um, but yeah, yeah, Henry's a beast. Um, Tena koe has maintained that's what that's what they want him to do. I still want him to give him the $118 million they gave him and he obviously already touched me. Right But um, yeah, yeah. I mean, he's, he's played he's played better than expected. So I mean, you know, it just it just makes you wonder what happened in Miami but, um, you know, I guess continuity and having a great running game really changes the game. But yeah, I mean, Cora Davis has emerged recently AJ Brown is awesome. I think I'm missing. I forget the name that's hanging out right now. I'm missing jonnu john doe. Yeah, john was played really well. So yeah, so they are good, but I had to close actually winning the Division I believe. No, Joe agreed with me and encouraged me on that, but I didn't I didn't have to close winning it. I just felt like reverse would be enough. In the end. I just didn't trust him now and I still don't um, but I said Tennessee is played well nevertheless.

Dave Clarke:

Alright, Joe, talk to me about those Colts.

Joe Malkin:

So we we screwed this up because this is the one where Craig and I should have more so actually, me more so listen to rayshawn and put the Colts up there. The Colts were a casualty of us lobbying to get the Steelers into that last playoff spot, which we we did get but we had to give up the Colts and that was what we we decided on so the record is going to be close. But obviously we weren't great with the the Texans. But you know what? I was down on this Colts team, putting them at nine and seven. I didn't think they'd get the double digit wins. And that's my fault, because I've said it before. And I'll say it again. I really like Frank Reich as a head coach in the NFL. I think what he's doing with that offense with rivers and brossette I mean, the confidence that he puts in both of those quarterbacks, I mean, one one is clearly been around forever and Jacoby brissette is is he's a veteran. But he he's only been around for five years, four years. So I really liked this Colts team. I think their defense is fun to watch. I think their offense is dynamic. I don't think it's the most fun offense to watch in the NFL. But they're dynamic, and they're speedy. So I mean, they they get the job done and having a healthy t y Hilton has been phenomenal for that team this year. I I'm up on them. I think that division if the Texans can find a head coach, because I don't think Romeo Coronel is going to be the head coach after 2020. But if they can find the head coach, I think that's another division where those three teams it's going to be like the NFC West, I think those three teams will battle it out for the next five years.

Dave Clarke:

So let me ask you this with the potential of one of those two teams, we just talked about squeaking the division and one potentially being the one of the AFC wildcard teams probably probably be one of the AFC wildcard teams between the two of you who would you say is a more likely candidate for a championship between the Titans and the Colts?

Rayshawn Buchanan:

Tennessee? Yep.

Joe Malkin:

I was gonna say ran let's say it on three, because I know we both believe it. I don't think the culture there yet because reverse isn't the long term solution there. But

Dave Clarke:

and we also saw the Titans in the playoffs last year in proof when they got

Joe Malkin:

exactly I mean, they came in and a beat a patriots team. I mean, Mike rabl is a is a very good head coach. He just he just exudes, he exudes confidence, and he knows what he's doing. And there was moments during their game today where he just you just know that he knows what he's doing. He has that coaches mind. And and I mean tannehill resurgent, he's still young Derrick Henry young. I mean, those those Johnny Smith young, it's just it's they're, they're in the right direction going in the right direction. I mean, Malcom Butler is having a hell of a season there. That's a good football team.

Dave Clarke:

Yeah. All right. Well, that does it for NFL predictions. I think that the overall lesson we can take is that we know somewhat what we're talking about. Except when Bobby says that the Steelers are the seventh best team in the NFL. No, we made it through without Bobby quitting the podcast. So we did it. Okay.

Unknown:

I was mad at barely.

Dave Clarke:

Joe and Ray were on my side as much didn't mean to gang up on you like that. But you did deserve it because of how dumb your rankings were it just for that. Just we'll see the other Raiders rates? Yes, we certainly will. I certainly will. Notice, every other ranking was perfectly informed. I just thought the Steelers were a little offensively low ranked. That's all

Joe Malkin:

he does. You will do understand we have to say this out loud. He does this. While he believes most of it. He does this to get one good arise out of us and putting the bills number two, which Bobby? Especially after I know that that bill's team, I think is legitimately the second best team in the AFC like, I think they're better than NFL.

Unknown:

Bobby is right.

Joe Malkin:

I think the tightness. I think the Titans are number three, but I think the bills are the second best team in the AFC

Dave Clarke:

well not to bring down the whole house of cards. But I do appreciate that you do all the work on the rankings, not me and I get to just get mad at you about it. So that's really really worked

Craig D'Alessandro:

out for me. Thanks for listening to this episode of missing the point. missing the point is a one hour podcast recapping the biggest stories in the world of sports with the norinco flavor. The show notes and transcript from today's show can be found in the description box below. As well as on our website, www dot MTP show.com. If you're new to the show and enjoyed what you heard, please consider subscribing. It's the easiest way to see when we publish new episodes. We are on iTunes, Spotify, Google and wherever you get your podcasts. Be sure to rate us and leave a review of any of our shows. We always appreciate your feedback. Let us know how we're doing and how we can sound better. Also, be sure to follow us on all of our social medias also Our links will be in the show notes and check out our brand new website. www dot MTP show.com. That's MTP show.com. For all of us here missing the point. I'm Craig D'Alessandro. We'll talk to you next time.