Examining Kyrie Trade, LeBron Record & NBA Trade Deadline:
Join Dave Clarke, Rob Kelly, and Rayshawn Buchanan in the latest "Missing the Point" as they dive into a full-on preview of the NBA Trade Deadline this upcoming Thursday. We'll also analyze the Celtics roster, highlight potential targets in the buyout market, and discuss the trade deadline. Specifically, if the Celtics should move Grant Williams, who has said he envisions a much more significant role for himself and might price himself out of Boston.
We'll delve into this week's blockbuster move of Kyrie Irving's trade to the Dallas Mavericks, his 4th franchise to play alongside superstar Luka Dončić. They will also be discussing the recent trade of Kyrie Irving to the Dallas Mavericks and the potential outcome of the trade.
Rob, Dave, and Ray will also discuss LeBron James breaking NBA's all-time scoring record, surpassing Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, and his status as a top-five player. They will compare LeBron to other NBA legends such as Michael Jordan, Kareem Abdul Jabbar, Bill Russell, and Kobe Bryant. The conversation will touch on the different eras of basketball and how it affects their rankings, Bill Russell's championship pedigree, and the possibility of Magic Johnson being an argument for switching someone in Dave's top five list.
Join the conversation as the trio delves into the exciting world of the NBA, offering insightful analysis and entertaining opinions on the latest developments in the league. Tune into "Missing the Point" for your fix of all things NBA.
01:25 NBA Trade Deadline Preview
04:05 Grant Williams' Role on the Celtics
06:03 Re-Evaluating Payton Pritchard's Role
11:07 Exploring Trade Options for Celtics
14:13 Trade and Buyout Options for the Boston Celtics
14:35 Reclamation Projects for the Celtics
17:15 Kelly Olynyk Reunion?
21:05 Kyrie Irving's Trade to the Boston Celtics
30:24 LeBron James in NBA History - Analyzing
40:07 LeBron James breaking the NBA’s all-time scoring record
44:44 LeBron James' Impact on the NBA
50:07 Kyrie Irving's Impact on the Dallas Mavericks
52:23 Kyrie Irving's Trade from the Brooklyn Nets to the Dallas Mavericks
53:57 Kyrie Irving's Future with the Dallas Mavericks
1:01:11 Brooklyn Nets' Recent Struggles in the NBA
1:04:46 Celtics and Lakers Rivalry
1:08:17 All-Star Weekend Preview
Thank you for your ongoing support. Remember to subscribe and share to show your support. If you want to see more content, be sure to subscribe to our channel. See you on our Twitch, Twitter, and Instagram pages:
Hosts: Dave Clarke, Bob Kelly, Rayshawn Buchanan
Producer: Craig D'Alessandro
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Dave Clarke 0:06
Welcome into missing the point it is a basketball show with myself DK sizzle rockin rockin a pink hoodie. Just going to make some good radio, you're going to create some, some visuals with my words to the to the listeners. We also have it on YouTube so you guys can just see that with your eyes, but I'm gonna paint you a picture. I'm sitting here in a pink hoodie with a fancy Red Sox hat on looking like I just rolled in from Miami Beach but the scumbag side Bobby looking like we just picked him up on fucking causeway Street. He's gotten nothing but it's another murder Celtics tanktop on and a fucking backwards green hat. Rayshawn is here looking like police would stop them for no reason. Everything is working out. Everything is working out. And listen, don't give
Rob Kelly 0:54
me that little walk in the line tonight. We're walking into that because I said
Dave Clarke 0:57
police would stop him for no reason. When realistically, we know it'd be a lot worse than that. Moving on to the basketball agenda for the night. Hey, listen, where was the lot? Where was the lie, guys? Okay, it's 2023. It just it's just the fucking way the world is I mean, yeah, but we're here to forget our problems and forget all the troubles in the world. And we're going to talk about basketball tonight. Not to mention all the things going on the fact that we're two days away from the trade deadline. The fact that the Celtics are the best teams statistically in the NBA the fact that Jayson Tatum is still in the MVP, race. All things we've been sort of touching on but I do want to start with the Celtics. And I want you guys to just tell me if I'm crazy when I bang this drum again Can we please trade Grant Williams like can we just trade Grant Williams Kelly a Linux out there? We got some trade exceptions to work with we've got a disabled player extension to work with. We've got a Grant Williams to work with. There was a report the other night that he thinks he's got a bag waiting for him in free agency,
Rob Kelly 2:06
bro. So I was on the fence until I saw that report.
Dave Clarke 2:09
20 million for Grant Williams. I'm very sorry, but that is not happening.
Rob Kelly 2:13
I don't need him chirping about playing time right now. Like, bro, there. There's nothing that I've seen from you over the past month that says I need more fucking playing time. That's like Get the fuck outta here with that shit. How after what we've seen, like this had been the worst Grant Williams stretch in the last two years, the last month and a half right? Like he's been useless on both ends. And
Dave Clarke 2:35
I think he's been equally as useless as he's always been to be honest with you. Except for like one little
Rob Kelly 2:39
run last year. He was good. Last year. He wasn't bad last year,
Dave Clarke 2:42
slightly towards the end of the regular season. He got better than he had a couple of decent series. And then he fell off when he needed to not fall off. So like for me? I don't know. I mean, Ray argue with me is the wing coverage that he provides is the minutes that he sorta helps with with Tatum and brown and some of that perimeter played. Is that worth it? Like, we're not paying 20 million for him, right?
Rayshawn Buchanan 3:08
Yeah, I mean, at this moment, honestly, like, I don't have arguments to keep him now.
Dave Clarke 3:14
Nobody. Nobody has an argument out.
Rayshawn Buchanan 3:16
Statistically. He's, he's been better because it's like, I think last year was 7.5. And that was at 8.9 points per game. He's showing 42 from three so on on the surface,
Rob Kelly 3:28
I test his
Rayshawn Buchanan 3:30
number wise, analytics wise, he's done that. But like you said, I think he had 25. And again, they played against Toronto last month. Since then. 7654. Like we're doing a fucking countdown. It's, it's not, it's not a happy new year. It hasn't been a happy new year. So, um, it's time. It's time. And Adam. Adam Taylor, who has missed someone who's I've seen on Twitter. You know, you've been banging the drum for you don't know, we don't know each other. But we've had some interactions on Twitter. You've been banging the drum for us keeping Grant Williams at what's the better option? There's plenty of better options. So instead of asking me as what is the better option? We can talk about Pirtle, we could talk about OGN and OB from from Toronto? Yeah. Well, there are plenty. Plenty. There are a few guys that we can it take, you know, taking everyplace grant and drive him to Logan Airport. But as we talked about earlier this afternoon before we got together, but there's so yeah, it's and it's really you're saying because I wanted to see him do well, I was very happy for him after the Milwaukee series last year. I was like, Okay, this is the ascension. But maybe he's, you know, maybe he's topped out and that's okay, that happens. I want to bring the Clark in his draft and we're gonna talk about the big Brandon Clark sick. Yeah, yeah. So grant talks been really good over there and methods so I didn't be fine with that. We got we got we got grant instead, whatever. There was a slight improvement, but it seemed like he speaks So yeah, I wouldn't be hurt if we moved on from him and for pain pressure they both need to go. I feel
Rob Kelly 5:05
like Grant Williams is is he has he wants his role to be too big for what he is so he he's the perfect stats on a bad team guy like I can see grant putting up 19 and 11 for like Charlotte and three years or like
Dave Clarke 5:24
that's what's gonna be happening 1911 might be a stretch but yeah, well
Rob Kelly 5:27
you know what I like because he's he's going to be centered he's going to be like the second or third option because that's just the kind of guy that I see him setting up for I don't think he's fitting into that roleplayer spot right now. And I know we we get hate on our all our hate for Grant Williams because we always have but like, but when you just watch him out there he looks he always looks like he's looking to get involved when it's not his fucking turn to get involved. Like bro you need you need to chill out and he's just his spatial awareness on the court is garbage.
Dave Clarke 6:03
Well, I to be honest with you, I think he can only really do one thing like he can shoot a wide open three you know and he can kind of sell selling up fake and take a big stride to the right and maybe hit that whatever three but he hasn't even been able to do that lately. I remember very specifically you re you Bobby and Mike did a show without me last year during the playoffs and it was a celebration of Grant Williams is play and I felt like oh, now I know I'm not on the show because I would definitely be the fucking one to ruin this entire vibe. I'm like it's not gonna last it's not like I'm happy to have been wrong if I am about what we talked about the start of the season with Sam Houser where I was like okay yeah like he's shooting well at the start of the year like that's not gonna last he did drop off but he's had a little bit of a resurgence in the past like guys like that. Those minutes I think on a championship team you can fuck with like, you can be like yeah, let's see what Sam Houser is gonna do for us tonight like okay, let's like switch up this rotation over here and like move these guys around. I want to revisit something that you just said Ray, which is like him and Payton Pritchard need to go I've I'm weirdly reconsidering that for this year. I feel like Payton Pritchard moving in the summer might be a better idea. Yes, he's bitching about his playing time also, which is obviously very frustrating on a team where you're like trying to win a fucking championship. It's like Dude, shut the fuck up. Seriously, like your Payton Pritchard? Like we're trying to win a fucking a banner right here. And that is annoying. But I can see a scenario where if we get cute, and we get rid of Payton Pritchard, if you're a couple of injuries away from needing Derek white to move 48 minutes and I'm not and I'm not anti Derek white. I love Derek white. 48 minutes for him is tough. You know, like in that when he's approaching that range of playing time. It's like he's not that guy. His style, I don't think really is appropriate for that he needs to get spelled out. Brogdon and white, and smart. Being our frontcourt is great, but like you're one or two injuries away from needing somebody to come fill in and Pritchard is a good pure shooter, which you sort of don't mind that in the guard position off the bench either so I don't know if I'd fuck with Payton Pritchard right now I feel like he's fine. We have so much to offer. As like we have more money to move around with, with the trade exceptions and the disabled player exception, which probably gonna fucking expire. Like, they're probably not gonna use that to be honest, because we have that from Gallinari. So we have that that TP we we have a little bit of money, we've got a billion fucking second round picks. I know that they you know, it's not football, I get it. But we've got a billion fucking second round picks, we owe a couple of first round picks to for different trades fine. But we can make a move with a Grant Williams centered package. To for the love of Christ. Get me a fucking guy that can rebound the ball. I know it's not that big of a deal. As far as like, we are winning every fucking game we play pretty much I get it. I'm not complaining about having the best record in the NBA. It's just frustrating that I can see a route to beating us and that's what it is. And you come up against an elite team in the playoffs. They'll find it you know they'll just crash the fucking boards on us so hard and we'll get so tired that I mean look what happened they're gonna happen last year.
Rayshawn Buchanan 9:08
But they don't the only team I'd be concerned about that actually had the nuggets norms of a nice
Dave Clarke 9:14
in the East I find because the nuggets I'm fucking
Rayshawn Buchanan 9:16
scared of seeing jump, I'm gonna jump Mumbrella we're fine. And buffalo we'd be playing the Western my band is by getting out these
Dave Clarke 9:25
nuggets kind of had our number in the regular season or whatever gone, you know? Sure.
Rayshawn Buchanan 9:29
But I feel like Milwaukee still poses a threat because that's the only team I'd be really I mean, obviously in Philly, but once again, when I tell Philly fences all the time. You have not beat us when it mattered since 1982. That's true. And you're Tony Billy Cunningham, Dr. J. Moses Malone, Murray's six, they're not walking through the door. So let it let it go and just enjoy the game. That's just how I see it. But yeah, I mean, I don't know. I mean, I I talk to you about earlier about it. Shannon's talked about Dwayne getting me finally game who's in Miami. That was that was bound to happen because he had a blow up with Erik Spoelstra. Yeah, small. Sure. And Miami coaches just like San Antonio, when you get in the face of the brass over there, you will get out of there very quickly. San Antonio was shared by our Dewayne dedmon just had a need for him there unless they're moving Jaco proto to another team preferably up here maybe a by Dwayne dam and maybe he's a guy that comes in and does it takes over coordinates minutes he shoots better in the coronet he defends but in the coronet regardless of the coordinate protest I know that's been a thing of this year. He's big on one always is not big in the corner but he is seven feet tall can't get you some rebounds. He just shoots into it like crazy. So like say once again not not a sexy move. But once again if you're looking to get the trade exception or you're looking to get someone what's what's actually he'd be practicable to disable player now what the note with the trade exception so either way, let's say they did look into it. Excuse me, but that's what it is.
Dave Clarke 11:07
I mean the buyout market we look nicer I feel like I feel like the bite like bio players want to come
Rob Kelly 11:12
we're the number one selection for the bio market for sure.
Dave Clarke 11:17
I mean there's there's guys out there that we could go get in that bio market like
Rob Kelly 11:21
Ray's gonna go water so it doesn't do his Doc Rivers impression anymore didn't necessarily exactly like Doc Rivers when he was just like, hey, hey, I love play pan plates great you know
Dave Clarke 11:32
i think i think i think it I think it adds a certain mystique Mystique to
Rob Kelly 11:37
it. No, I enjoyed it. So the thing I've I see Grant Williams is rumored to go to the magic as a big spot and the Spurs also interested which it kind of leads right into what Ray was saying where I think boydell for for grant. Make sense, man. It just it just makes sense for both teams.
Dave Clarke 11:58
What about Jae Crowder?
Rob Kelly 12:00
I know you want the Crowder reunion again, man I well I liked Crowder
Dave Clarke 12:05
he got better when he left I don't think he's the same guy anymore. I think that he's stuck in Phoenix. I think that there's weird shit going on
Rob Kelly 12:13
really bad in the playoffs last year.
Dave Clarke 12:14
No I get it. I mean I understand but it's a bio like it's not like to me after a guy that can come and be seven feet tall like Luke Hornet Okay, yeah, it's super cute guys like I love it like I love that he jumps up in the air when like he's very far away from a perimeter shooter it's adorable and it's great. He can't be on the floor during the playoffs like he cannot be it's not it's not something that we can have that's not a scenario we want to see. I just want to let you guys know that right I mean he's been very serviceable rotation guy in the regular season but you know No, we got to shorten the rotation passing Luke cornet if we want to make a run in the playoffs, and I think we do. So we got to go get like we got to go get somebody like that size and they can spell Allen. We know all this stuff about Robert Williams is injuries. But we also do need a little bit of wind cover still. I mean, it's been encouraging that there's been nights where it Tatum's out and brown still wins us games and there's been nights where Browns out and Tatum obviously has that ability will still win us games like that's definitely encouraging. But when it comes to April May those minutes add up we saw it last year like it's it's kind of a it's kind of a banana peel that you don't want to slip on not having enough minutes to kind of unload from the wings. That's what Gallinari came in do. And if you do trade Grant Williams, you do have to replace that somehow like that. And I for me, it's like why not? You know like i Yes, you're granted. Jae Crowder, not great. Not great in the playoffs last year, but that whole team fell off. That whole team fell off from the run that they made like it wasn't just Jay Crowder's fault like the whole fucking thing came crumbling down the whole house of cards fell so you know, Brad likes him obviously like, you know, they might be grudgingly do a buyout that that's us getting them on the cheap. You know, so to me I feel like it's worth worth a gamble and he think he would fit the style of basketball we play now more than he did before even
Rob Kelly 14:13
he fits rolls better than what he did here in Boston Boston, he definitely he he checked himself a few times too many for my liking. With with that with that spread like jumpshot that he has he
Rayshawn Buchanan 14:25
had some gold what do you what do you think? We're in Dawson?
Rob Kelly 14:29
Here yay, mirror Johnson. I loved Amir Johnson, bro,
Rayshawn Buchanan 14:33
I did want me defensively. Yeah, but offseason, Evan
Rob Kelly 14:35
Evan Turner. Yeah, so So we keep talking about big man. A name I've been hearing a lot that we were working at is another topic reclamation project and Nerlens Noel, you know, a follow on that Jabari Parker, right where it's like, you know, it's a name, and it's a dude that you know, has talent. You know, do you think if you fit him into that Cornette role He he doesn't he makes more of an impact and coordinate right? Don't you think?
Dave Clarke 15:05
Yeah, I guess I mean, it's just like I think you're I think there is a little bit of a name tax on a guy like that. Like I think that that follows him around across the course of his career and I'm not sure that his statistics have ever really match that I think like what are you asking him to come do? Are you asking him to come be like what Luke Cornette has been for us?
Rob Kelly 15:26
1010 10 minutes 10 to 12 minutes a game Max Max and four to five rebounds. You know what I mean? Get get get those
Dave Clarke 15:37
my fear would my fear would be like a lot of Nerlens Noel stat lines with like, two points on it. I mean, like, yeah, you're spelling Rob Williams, but, like Rob's offensive production has improved a lot. And I feel like Nerlens Noel is going to come in and score like, four points for too many minutes. You know what I mean? Like, I feel like my stole the
Rayshawn Buchanan 15:55
blocks of 10 minutes, though,
Dave Clarke 15:56
would you write it? Yeah, of course. No, I definitely would. I think my fear is a guy like that coming in and like, it's like, I guess it's a chemistry issue in my head right now. Like it's it doesn't seem like a direct plug and play for me. A guy like Jake Crowder, coming back, you're like, well, at least you know, where the entrance is, you know, like, you know, Brad Stevens already. Like, you know, Jayson Tatum already. Like, there's something about that. And, to me, like there's a little bit of Nerlens Noel baggage, not a ton. I mean, he's not like a complete prick or anything, but like, there is a little bit of baggage there where it's like, is it I mean, I guess it's sort of the same as the Blake Griffin situation. It's like, if he doesn't contribute, it doesn't really matter that much. Right? You're not paying like a ludicrous amount of money for him to be there.
Rob Kelly 16:39
They changed the entrance at the garden, so he doesn't know it anymore.
Dave Clarke 16:42
Shed nevermind then. Don't bring him he can't find his way in.
Rayshawn Buchanan 16:50
No, say what about Jared Vanderbilt from Oh, love it. He's He's, he's I think that for him. That was really and that is someone will Dota two guys. Once again, I don't know why they would give up on them. But to me, it's at least worth a phone call. Vanderbilt is more of what this offense looks
Dave Clarke 17:08
like. That's a completely different proposition. Like that's a guy that can that he can bore. You know, go get us five to eight rebounds.
Rob Kelly 17:15
He helps he helps preserve Rob. That's simple.
Dave Clarke 17:20
That's a more that, to me is a more exact, like backup for Rob Williams. You know, I that's
Rob Kelly 17:25
Rob. He takes like five minutes off a rock playing time. Yeah, and it's good. Five minutes. Another name we talked about offense and other big man, PJ Washington. I've been hearing a lot. And I like
Rayshawn Buchanan 17:37
sci fi actually. Yeah, and
Rob Kelly 17:39
he's He's a big man.
Dave Clarke 17:41
What are we gonna let all those fucking things expire? Like let's do something bad. That's
Rob Kelly 17:45
what they do.
Rayshawn Buchanan 17:46
Yeah. I don't know who's left though. Because I know it's I want to say it's the one all the jocks which is the one that wanted to hurt me going with hernia going go medical, excuse me, is gone. But I think that was like 5.0 Dennis. Sure. That's what it was. It's his it's on its own agenda. So they would have to use it before they have to use a Thursday.
Rob Kelly 18:05
If we're talking about a reunion Oh, Kelly Olynyk the guy I that's what I'm saying. Kelly Linux that guy. I mean, he's a little undersized. But I have very fond memories of Kelly. Listen, I I was I was at game seven against the warriors to Kelly a when a GO game. Wasn't Yeah. Seeing so if he can come back and contribute. Listen, we just did it with Tyson. And to me, I know I can be alone on this sometimes. But Tice was a fucking waste of space. And we brought him back so why not Kelly Olynyk because he can do a hell of a lot more.
Dave Clarke 18:34
I think it's a little bit of a different proposition. Kelowna is more expensive. He's a lot better at basketball. That's Daniel tastes like he just he is like if we're being honest like he has more
Rob Kelly 18:42
gave him shrewd.
Dave Clarke 18:43
I mean, I guess your sucks too. All right. Yeah. Not great. Not a great example. But shooters potential we give up shooters potential to sometimes be good. But I mean, yeah, I mean, Kelly Olynyk. Again, perfect spelling for Robin Williams and and maybe even submitted to some stretch and rotation and even Taylor Tua
Rob Kelly 19:01
or like, you already played with Tatum minutes. Yeah.
Rayshawn Buchanan 19:05
Right here without the last year he was here. It was our first year here. So also Kelly
Dave Clarke 19:10
Lennox, like an effort guy. And I feel like if there's one thing I could contribute or like or criticize, I mean to this team is that they and you know, not say don't know it. I mean, Jaylen Brown and Jayson are both Command said this shit in the past six months, but sometimes they pick when they want to play and it's been a little less I guess often lately, but like they do go and spell sometimes where you're just like, fuck, you guys aren't even really trying. Kelly analytics, like a little bit of a sparkplug? You know, like you can bring off the bench and like he brings energy and he brings effort and he brings D plays defense. It's another thing I wouldn't mind having Jae Crowder out there for is like, you can put them on some guys. You know, it's like I you can go guard that guy. Like it'll be fine. It'll be okay for 10 minutes. Like we can live through this.
Rob Kelly 19:57
If you think about that second unit that be dope and Kelly Olynyk. Derrick white if we
Dave Clarke 20:02
could just have like 20 like that. First Brad Stevens here. Like the second Brad Stevens here. We could just have that as the bench. I think that's what we're all asking for here.
Rayshawn Buchanan 20:13
Yeah, I'm even even some of them we want. He's not coming back here. He's in Sweden right now. But like my guy, Jonas Jerebko. I love
Rob Kelly 20:19
Joe. It is
Dave Clarke 20:20
so good. Let's go get both the Morris Morris brothers. Let's get Mark Keefe and Mark is
Rayshawn Buchanan 20:26
like, Gary, but yeah, I'll mark it.
Rob Kelly 20:31
Where is it a Celtics podcast if we don't say hey, why don't we just go get it? We might as well go get it. You know,
Rayshawn Buchanan 20:38
you know? This this is this is this is ridiculous a lot that I don't want people to take this seriously.
Rob Kelly 20:43
I'm sure. Yeah, no, we're not getting fucking it is I almost I almost feel
Rayshawn Buchanan 20:47
like it's almost like we went in when until he's back on the team. Because of how it went down. Because there's still there's still people that feel like, well, y'all fucked up
Rob Kelly 20:55
by He's like, he's like the billy goat. He's
Rayshawn Buchanan 20:59
just put them at the end of the bench. Let him be you know, lamb come in, you know, you know, I agree.
Dave Clarke 21:05
I think we need to dispel that curse a little bit. I really do. Because like, it was a little every point guard that came after him. Like it was just weird.
Rayshawn Buchanan 21:16
Like it was a cabinet. Okay, it was just he just injured but kept Kimbo Tembo
Dave Clarke 21:19
was I know, but like, that's like, that's good. That's some bad juju. Right? Like, that's like a curse.
Rob Kelly 21:23
I feel like it sells expense fault, too. Because I know when I saw the trade, I know some people were pissed. I'm like, yo, fuck it. Yeah, I mean to it I was like, bro, Kyrie would go punk. Like,
Rayshawn Buchanan 21:38
I want to add to that record, I think I think I actually I remember, I was still in Miami at the time. And I remember being I was at my desk, and I saw your salary alert, actually, that my one of my students already learned. He said Mr. He said he was gonna trade at Boston. I said, I said, get out of here. Yeah, no. I said, No, no way. He's so me. I said, What? What was wild? I will just as about a month before that saying, well, if carriers aren't happy in Cleveland, he's three years younger than your current point guard. At least get the call. And bam. It had happened in August. And next thing you know, man, once again, that first shit went fine. They weren't 16 in a row. People forget that. I remember the game with Alice. In one in Miami. He had he had good moments here. He had very good moments is a
Rob Kelly 22:22
great transition. Oh, of course.
Dave Clarke 22:24
I mean, it's been a lot of fun. It's been a lot of fun to be a Celtics fan of last few years and like I would say last year being the only exception. I think the most fun I've had since 2008 though was like it it versus John Wall. And that wizard series like that was just like the most fun I've had watching basketball.
Rob Kelly 22:41
I don't know when when Tatum and brown pushed fucking LeBron in the seventh game. Yeah, but that was fun. I was
Dave Clarke 22:49
gotten rid of game seven like that. That got that got shit on because like we fucked up like we had him.
Rob Kelly 22:55
Terry Rozier I've never seen someone Miss jumpshot so badly. It wasn't just
Dave Clarke 22:59
it wasn't just him. Everybody fucking missed every single jump shot. For sure Jae Crowder missed a good few and that came actually,
Rayshawn Buchanan 23:07
to Terry's defense. He went off for us a game six and we blew it. Hit me Jaylen
Dave Clarke 23:13
so bad when that series like you can't remember that series is like that fun because we fucked it up like we hadn't. We had our foot on their throats and we fucked it up. Oh, it was a good lesson. And they were kids and it's not a big deal. But like, I don't know.
Rob Kelly 23:28
Got it. So I have we can alternate universitari for you. So I think we are fucking until we bring it back. Because what I think was supposed to happen was we went through all that with it right? He fucked his hip up. We were supposed to keep him and have that be like, we can't fucking trade it. You know, he used to He's our guy. He did all this for us. We were supposed to have like this at the space at point guard because of his hip for years. But instead it just got injected into our team and went to Hayward. It went to Canva Tyree is all in.
Dave Clarke 24:00
Yeah, there's been some bad injuries usually. I mean, I would really like it if Danilo Gallinari was healthy right now. Like
Rayshawn Buchanan 24:06
I think I think he's coming playoff time. Yeah, that's
Rob Kelly 24:09
been here, man. I heard I heard him pushing it if we had got one Irie we we
Dave Clarke 24:15
we people forget he's 610 Like people forget that. He's 610 Have you heard it? Have you seen heard his song?
Rob Kelly 24:21
No. It's awesome. Isn't say someone wrote a song about him? It's like a techno song. looking amazing. Yeah,
Dave Clarke 24:29
love it. I'll check it out after the pot via but like he Yeah, he's 16 he can rebound he can score inside like he he's it's not 100% His game but like he can do it. That size on the floor is is good. You know he can rotate multiple guys back onto the bench to rest so even if you get 10 minutes a night out and hit him over 12 minutes a night and maybe certainly a pipe dream but that'd be sick. Honestly, I if we had that going into the playoffs I would 100% just like throw him in there and try that out and see what it looks like. I don't think that's like a big deal. All right. That was fun time about the Celtics. As usual, I think we should dedicate a little bit of time to the trade deadline and to some other news around the rest of the NBA, looking like LeBron is going to break that scoring record. I suppose we should have oh, what's he got? Yeah, he needs to get like 38 or something tonight. Right, right.
Rayshawn Buchanan 25:19
Yeah. There's six, there's
Dave Clarke 25:23
636. I mean, I think he looked like he was going to do it coming into the building. So that's going to be that game is going to start right after we get off this pod. So could be the last time we're talking before. LeBron isn't the scoring, title holder. I don't think it's going to change the conversation about what we think of LeBron James, like all that much. I think that the way that his legacy is sort of shaping up, I think people are going to remember him as one of the best of all time, but I'm not. I'm not really sure. He's in the top two. I don't think he cracked it. I don't think that he just because of the conversation, like I know people that are standard LeBron James, like, they can name every stat Yeah, he's gonna get the scoring record for sure. You know, they can name all these stats, but there's just still that thing where it's like, you'd still rather have Michael Jordan, you'd still rather have Kobe Bryant because they were killers. And they might not have been as fun at parties because they're mean, but if they were veteran like they, you know, that's who you want to go when you were fucking championship right? And as much as LeBron was a killer, and he was the most talented player I've probably ever seen. Definitely the most talented player I've ever seen. Actually, that's without question. I'm curious what what you guys think of where his legacy is shaping up if you think he's ever going to win another championship, because I don't at this point. And what this like scoring title means, like in his legacy, I mean, it might be a generational thing for me of what I think about him. I just haven't changed my mind. Like maybe I'm crazy. But
Rayshawn Buchanan 26:56
yeah, he's Musement downplaying it.
Dave Clarke 27:00
Yeah, cuz he's got a good PR guy.
Rayshawn Buchanan 27:01
But I mean, I get to he's, at this moment. He's still chasing championships and I get that this is a phenomena not chasing the ship. I never I never thought that this would disrupt it will be broken, specifically broken anyways. So it was awesome that we're seeing this in our lifetime. So just like people fell in the 80s when they saw Caribbean break was record so
Dave Clarke 27:21
when I'm shot like one three point shot and so crowd's point, yeah, crazy.
Rayshawn Buchanan 27:27
You also I noticed some that cream is still was pretty
Dave Clarke 27:29
insane. Like, like his.
Rob Kelly 27:32
Yeah, it's two different levels. Yeah.
Rayshawn Buchanan 27:34
Yeah. No, I mean, that's, that's insane. Yeah, exactly. It's the same last point on him, like all that stuff. But yeah, yeah, I think um, but he also played for our platoon. So I mean, it's not like he Well, he played 10 years and got
Dave Clarke 27:45
Oh, for sure. I mean, LeBron is playing it a ludicrous amount of basketball, right? It's just take anything away from him. I think that he's still at this level. It's insane. It really is. Credit to
Rayshawn Buchanan 27:55
this when we invest so much in your body like that's you shouldn't it's like
Dave Clarke 27:59
a million dollars a year he spends on
Rayshawn Buchanan 28:02
me so I mean to me, Listen, he's definitely top three. If someone's saying he's top five fine. That's that's okay.
Dave Clarke 28:10
He got my five I actually got him at five to be
Rayshawn Buchanan 28:13
up pass Kobe for me the moment he passed them to Philadelphia a few years ago, that that's just that's just my opinion on it. Yes, mentality wise, of course issues in Kobe, but I'm like, there's nothing else that you're choosing, you're taking, like, once again, he scores as well. He defended as well. He's one of the MVP. He's like, there's no other. There's nothing else that that measures up like he's passed. He's daft everybody, except MJ never got it. So I'm, I'm gonna tell I'm excited for him myself. I said to me, he's top three. Once again. The man has been on on the Sports Illustrated cover since the age of 16.
Rob Kelly 28:49
The age I remember that I remember.
Rayshawn Buchanan 28:52
Never got into major trouble. never gotten into any any really major scandals. Yeah, once again, does he does he complain and whine too much? Sure, sure. But like you said, the talent, the skill set, the playmaking is undeniable. Totally. We will miss him when he's gone.
Dave Clarke 29:11
Oh, yeah. No, for sure. I mean, I think I think we're very lucky to have like, yeah, it's
Rayshawn Buchanan 29:14
tough to talk through for sure.
Dave Clarke 29:16
I definitely agree with you in the sense that I think we're lucky to have seen him and I think it's I think we're lucky to have seen a lot of great athletes over the course of of our sports watching lifetimes. I just think for me, I think maybe it's the way I was just conditioned to watch basketball. It's like the things I look for in players that I love LeBron doesn't necessarily possess I think you know what I'm talking about like if if my favorite Celtic ever is Allen Iverson that I'm not going to really fit the mold to be LeBron James fan. I don't think that's not to say I don't understand how good he is. But to me, it's like it when people ask you for your top five all time or your your best starting five or whoever you want to look at it to me. It's like, I'm trying to build a team. I'm trying to put them in a circle. stands a realistic circumstance where Who do I want to go with me a championship? And I'm not doing this thing that like I'm not being a LeBron hater, but like LeBron is like statistically just as likely to lose in the finals. I mean, so it's like it to me. It's like, I mean, I understand there's extenuating circumstances. And I understand that there's context involved here. But Bobby, where do you put LeBron all time at this point, and like, talk to me about the scoring title?
Rob Kelly 30:24
So I just kind of look at it differently where it's like, you guys know me i i don't like speaking in absolutes when it comes to the goats. Nothing is like that, bro. Because like, I hate that fucking conversation where it's like, rubbish. Or its
Dave Clarke 30:41
legacy, we're just
Rob Kelly 30:43
he's the most he's the most accomplished player in the history of the NBA. And there's no there's no, really disagreeing with that when it comes to stats, rebounds, assists, he or sets, points rebounds, assists eligible players, right? No one's higher on those ladders, consistently. No one's played more minutes, no one has had that impact on the game. However, Michael Jordan is still the greatest basketball player of all time. It's, you know what I mean? It's he, he is the go to basketball, but LeBrons a goat of accomplishments and stats. And when we look back LeBrons career like 20 years from now, it's only gonna be about the fact that he's a scoring champion. Rebound, he might, he might end up rebounds later to right or top five and assists in top five and rebounds. Right? So
Dave Clarke 31:36
no, I mean, I but I guess it's a matter of what's important to you. When you're looking at a player and you're and you're lionizing or you're idolizing a player.
Rob Kelly 31:45
He's one. He's wondering. So, remember, championships are really fucking hard to win. And he's won one in each destination he's gone to. So I mean, don't get me wrong, LeBron is definitely a bitch that that whole temper tantrum he threw at the end of that game, like literally encapsulates who LeBron is, as a person, at least, at least like last five to 10 years.
Dave Clarke 32:06
I would just like to say like, honestly, that's really unfair. That call was really unfair. And like, if, if that the person that was fouled was like, still a top five player in the NBA like they would, they would have made that call. But unfortunately, when you drop off, you don't get those superstar calls anymore. You know, if somebody on Jayson Tatum level was getting fouls, if that person existed, then, you know, maybe he would have gotten the call, but like, I'm so sorry, when you're just a regular guy playing on the second worst team in the West. eautiful calm, it's just it's the way I know it's not fair. But it's the game.
Rob Kelly 32:41
It was definitely a foul. I mean,
Dave Clarke 32:45
it was, it was the most obvious
Rob Kelly 32:47
definition of a vowel. You know what I mean? Like when you look up
Dave Clarke 32:51
referees like this is what a shooting phallus
Rob Kelly 32:54
but so but like when I say that encapsulates LeBron, I really mean that because like, the temper tantrum, yes, on one spectrum, but on the other spectrum, was, I was 100% Sure, he was getting a clean drive to the layup on that last play. You saw when he was at the top of the three point line, you know, he had that LeBron Ime puck and taking it to the rim. And there's nothing you can fucking do about a mentality. He doesn't have that as much anymore because he's older. So I get the recency bias. But you gotta remember like, this is a different LeBron than what what? LeBron was at his peak. It's so long ago now that I feel like people kind of forget, like that Miami series against the Celtics. I will never I can't even imagine a more dominant basketball player than what LeBron was in game six. It was It was unbelievable. Like I I wasn't alive for the MJ you know the subprime of that MJX right that that was 63 Is that what it was? Yeah, right that is that that that three that dagger three in the fourth quarter right he just came up in in stepback 42 footer no fucking doubt and he just walked out like yep, this my fucking championship. You guys can go fuck yourselves.
Rayshawn Buchanan 34:21
That was the floor
Rob Kelly 34:25
right they did lose that year they ended up losing
Rayshawn Buchanan 34:28
Miami beat them back to back years ago saying like that play you're talking about me 245 15 And five was was wanting to all game safe but that three I thought was the year before because they hit it and they will date you to talk they want to share memories. Yeah, it doesn't merge it hurts. hurtful, but accurate to say
Rob Kelly 34:46
it's what? The whole look at the whole the whole picture when you look at the whole picture. I just find it hard to believe that he's not top five walltime I really do. I say I had him five. But like are so All right, give me the four. Give me the four. Give me the four. Number one is Michael Jordan. Okay. Okay. In Kobe, Kobe being I get it. I didn't
Dave Clarke 35:07
say number two is Kobe number one is Michael Jordan. Number two is Kareem Abdul Jabbar. Okay. Number three is Bill Russell. Number four is Kobe Bryant number five's Lebron James. That's my top five.
Rob Kelly 35:20
I just, it's so it's I'm sorry. I'll let you do you. But it's so hard because it's so such different eras. You know what I mean? Like?
Dave Clarke 35:29
Well, you have to take each of them in context. Yeah. Just take each of their accomplishments and what they did their skill sets, what they bring to the table, their championship pedigree. All these things I think have to factor in. I think it's why Bill Gates weighted so heavily when you when you look at championship pedigree like it's literally and figuratively unmatched. He, yes, it's a different era, but it doesn't matter. You play what's in front of you, contextually. He's part of the reason why we're here talking about the NBA a big part of the reason I, I could see an argument for switching out either my for my five for Magic Johnson to be to be 100% honest with you, if I'm trying my best to eliminate the idea of Larry Bird being our patron saint.
Rob Kelly 36:15
I thought you were gonna say of Lakers. No,
Dave Clarke 36:17
I mean, listen, at the end of the day. I think Larry Bird was a more talented basketball player, the magic Magic Johnson. But if you look at what they accomplished from the last night of their college careers, to the end of their NBA careers, it's difficult for me to argue that magic doesn't have have a greater list of accomplishments because he just he just does. He just has more. So I wouldn't like to you know, I would like to see some different things happen. And for instance, the 87 finals, like show up whatever, but it is what it is, I think, yeah, there's a lot of Lakers on my list already, unfortunately. And it's took for me to fucking keep LeBron up the fucking up the pole. And I think it's because you what you said, it's this individual accomplishments. To me, it's like, yeah, sure. But I also watched him like, decide he was a GM a few times and like, fuck up teams. I watched him take his talents to South Beach. I watched him fucking like not to even begin to get into that. I watched him decide to go play for like a lot of different teams. I watched him leave his hometown team twice. I, you know, I watched him bitch moan and complain. throughout his entire career. It's impossible to argue with his individual stance, and it's impossible to argue with his talent, bottled talent. I think he fills up more of a bottle than any other player in the history of the game. I and I includes Michael Jordan, I think on just what he was born with his size, the fact that he was that fast for a size, the fact that I mean, it slept on a little bit, honestly. But the fact that he was probably one of the best pastors of all time, to be honest with you. The fact that he went he should have already done it. But when he learned a postgame and came back after that map series, and won a championship Miami that was all very impressive. That was definitely him doing that, too. That wasn't D Wade or Bosh at that point. But he also watched like dirt be like, fuck this guy. Like, that's to me when you hear the legends of the greats. And maybe it's because we were alive during and we watched it when you hear the legends of the greats and you're watching like the last dance and like Michael Jordan is a meme about what it's like to not fuck around and win yourself championships and LeBron James is Dirk Nowitzki being like, fuck this kid sounds like I'm taking my talents to South Beach and dirt just fucking drop and turn around jumpers on him for as much as many times as he wanted. And Paul Pierce going toe to toe with him when motherfuckers go on hold last tours talking about how my how Paul Pierce isn't as good as Paul Pierce thinks he is. And the whole like everyone clowning on him when it was him versus D way. But Paul Pierce fucked him up one on one when he was younger. So like, whatever. These aren't stories you hear about the all time greats. So yes, I agree with you individually. It's difficult. But to me, it's like how I'm conditioned to watch basketball. How I'm conditioned to idolize these grades and what it takes to be great what we've been told what we've been told over and over what it is to be great. It's the if LeBron James in 30 years is in the coolest basketball commercial on TV. And he says something akin to at the end of the day, this game is and always will be about buckets. That will never be as cool as when Bill Russell said it is because when he says shit. You listen, because he has that thing about him. You know he did all this other shit outside of being an NBA player Kareem Same deal. Michael Jordan absolute assassin, Kobe Bryant, absolute fucking assassin they have this other thing this other batch that makes them elevate themselves over just raw talent. And I think LeBrons are probably a really nice guy. He's probably a better hang than all these dudes. But if you got to ride into the valley, if you know if you got to fucking face down them Monster he's not he's not Aragorn if you threw up fucking situation he's just not so that's my issue I think.
Rob Kelly 40:07
And I was I get it it's a different mindset when you've been the king your whole life versus you know, Toby being drafted 14th overall out of high school playing in France
Dave Clarke 40:18
maybe I'm too into the narrative.
Rob Kelly 40:21
I think I think it's more of just like it's been expected of LeBron to be this guy his whole career. So no one was ever like, what? Like, look at this guy was like, Yeah, brothers LeBron,
Dave Clarke 40:35
which I think I think is an argument in his defense. I don't even think that's fair.
Rob Kelly 40:39
It's not it's that's what I mean. It's the same. It's like there was no there was
Dave Clarke 40:44
every single year, but it got boring. Like, that's a true thing that happened, right? Like he should have been MVP every single year without boring like, I'm not arguing with how good he is. I'm really not right. You look disappointed in me. He looked disappointed in my past. He brought his
Rob Kelly 40:58
old an old Eric Snow was Eric snow and who's ZIL Jonas obviously who was the other big score? They
Dave Clarke 41:08
they had Mike Willis. Who was the point guard,
Rob Kelly 41:11
ugly dude. Danielle Marshall Danielle Marshall. Not sorry, Daniela you're not ugly. I'm Yeah,
Rayshawn Buchanan 41:19
no, right. No, that's funny. No, not disappointing. Right. He's, he has disappointed me that disappointed that I'm just disappointed that you even have to make that comparison. Right. Just like you said, he should have got MVP most years. Except the narrative is like, Oh, you have to give it to somebody else. And it's like no, it's the most valuable player so I mean, the
Dave Clarke 41:44
last year Russ one it should have still been LeBron at that point. You know, I'm in agreement with you on that.
Rayshawn Buchanan 41:50
And so it's just like to me what I mean I mean when you when I mean when you average over everybody I mean that that's special like I was I get by Ross got it.
Dave Clarke 41:59
I bet you watched it happen though right? You did watch the people be like well let him get the rebound. Well let him get the rebound let him get that
Rayshawn Buchanan 42:06
much but even less as someone who lives in Miami when I said the fears he was out there and how much I went to a playoff game and I'm just like I don't know if it's been for that four or five years he was daily I don't know if I've seen better basketball from like, it was it was it was unreal. After the apple moves. The like I remember the game in New Orleans. He had the he had fortitude may 6 threes in the first half. It was handled from the parking lot late one was just like what do you like what do you do today? That that was the final thing to unlock his game. He could do everything else but I mean yo he's pleased he's any 40% from three in Miami like what what do you do? You can't do anything?
Rayshawn Buchanan 42:48
I can go home I'll give it away or I can get a boss or I can just say about it. Oh I give it some reality like it was it was it was too much I wish he ended up staying there. I get why at fit his narrative to go back home and when I get that gonna you know he had unfinished business so to speak. And as my but I just wish that you stated that with Miami because we probably saw more Wade I mean Bosch had to help things it was different but you
Dave Clarke 43:11
would have had more more good teams around them if he stayed for sure. For sure. And I just the the way that that team is run is better than any other team that he's ever been on.
Rob Kelly 43:20
I just I just think Tom Brady and I always come back to this kind of ruined he ruins the idea of of a championship player because wasn't 10 years ago a guy that won championships in three separate places you're right championships is is is a winner he's he's
Dave Clarke 43:41
like he's almost a victim of like they're there if you don't have the ability to be mysterious anymore it in today's world like you everyone's online like you can go to any like everything you do is watched you know you're you can be put in any context that anyone wants you to be put in. You don't just go out play the game and then you're you know, you completely recede back into your life. I see your point I genuinely do see your point he is a little bit of a victim of the times he's a little bit of a victim of his own success. He's a little bit of a victim of you're right like the greatness that was around him and like other sports and also say that comeback against the Warriors which is probably the best team of the last 10 years. Is that is that that Golden State Warriors team that wasn't just anybody that he made that comeback against and him topping it off like as much as I can reshot is remembered we're all pretty much in agreement that that block is what made is that was the moment right? So wherever it was like oh, this is over. This is like either
Rayshawn Buchanan 44:44
stainable like karaoke gets her in game one. Obviously love got hurt and as he was against us in the first round, like that 2015 Run to Yeah, yeah, but but it was on real and
Dave Clarke 44:58
equally. He's honest. As the victim of like that Kevin Durant warriors team where he was made to look incredibly average and that finals like, i That was the worst I've ever seen him play in the playoffs I wasn't I think it because
Rob Kelly 45:12
he knew I also I also knew how overwhelmed I imagined
Rayshawn Buchanan 45:17
that though you get 40 A night and a leg in
Dave Clarke 45:20
cash compared to his own compared to his own standard you know and a victim of his own success and that's like when you're I've seen I watch Kevin Durant like break his fucking ankles in that series you know what I mean? Like absolutely break his ankles on the perimeter
Rayshawn Buchanan 45:34
yeah that that then less I was crazy. Yeah,
Dave Clarke 45:38
he's you know exactly the plan I'm talking about is early in the series and like, like Katie just looked like, like an odd like in that moment to me I'm watching that I'm like Katie looks like the most unplayable player I've ever seen in my life. Like you're talking about you've never seen better basketball from the problem or you're in Miami I get that I think there's an argument to be made in the context of our lifetimes. que de when surrounded by all those guys and hitting those heights. I've never seen anything like that. I was like, There's no way you can go and get in there. This you know, and, and we're I think we're a little spoiled. I honestly I do. I think we're a little squirrel we have all this fucking we watched all these these different great players. There's so many good players in the NBA since we were little munchkins that were a little bit You're right. We're a little bit fucking easy for me to say because I didn't watch half the guys on my fucking list in life, you know, so I get it.
Rob Kelly 46:28
And it's like when you think about so like David Robinson, right? Considered like one of the best winners of all time to championships. Kobe Bryant will consider one of the best winners of all time five. LeBron has for Larry Bird, one of the best winners of all time. Three. You know what I mean? It's just like you get on the list. It's just it's such a different standard nowadays, man where it's like, I don't know. It blows
Dave Clarke 46:50
my mind. So he's also always put next to Jordan in conversations. He's always blessed. Why
Rob Kelly 46:56
I know but I it's still to me. Back. Yeah, yeah, I guess so. Don't ya six for six. Yeah, yes. I feel like I really do feel like Brady ruined it because it's like now. April 8, it's
Dave Clarke 47:14
Tom Brady ruined sports. He
Rob Kelly 47:15
No, he got he ruined he ruined people's mindset. Because Jordan was a different level. Jordan Jordan Jordan was the best basketball player anyone that ever seen. But Tom Brady just came in out of nowhere, and dominated the sport for 20 years. So that's what people see the expectation as as the goat as the greatest as the best ever. Like you have to do that. And just because LeBron, you know, like I said, winning an NBA championship is so fucking hard. And it's like it's a to get to seven to win. For for right for because you went to a moment
Rayshawn Buchanan 47:50
where he's been in the finals.
Rob Kelly 47:53
It's, it's like, how does this compare
Rayshawn Buchanan 47:55
the amazement of finals?
Rob Kelly 47:57
It's just well, 20 years from now when we look back up all right. It's, we're gonna be like, What the hell were we fucking talking about? Man? Because like, it's, I'm telling you, man, because like, when
Dave Clarke 48:10
you look back at these guys, yeah, no, you're not leaving. Everybody that's like definitely cast in line is a little bit more. And I think what I'm trying to do is, is really just hold on to the fact that in 2008, every single person in Boston was calling him a fucking bitch.
Rob Kelly 48:28
He still is out.
Dave Clarke 48:32
Now letting people scrub that shit out of history. Okay, I've been hating him for a long time and I'm not gonna fucking stop now. All right,
Rayshawn Buchanan 48:38
there you go. I got I got your name cuz I was. Now I am disappointed because but Bobby brought up his teammate, but then nobody knows this guy. But you talked about David Robinson. Don't talk about the Big Foot.
Rob Kelly 48:51
Tim Duncan. I know. Listen, I actually have Jack guy.
Rayshawn Buchanan 48:55
He beat a lot of your feet. He'd beat LeBron. He'd be Kobe. He'd be all your favorite players have been talking about.
Dave Clarke 49:02
Also, difficult thing for me to say out loud. But it is. And it's the hardest thing that I will say in the context of talking about a basketball about basketball is a sport but Tim Duncan was kgs father, he was his dad. Any single day ever played like he
Rob Kelly 49:21
that was at the oh two semis 202 semis bro wishes he put him on his shoulders it was like Can you see the parade Okay,
Dave Clarke 49:28
style makes styles make fights and I think that he was just like the worst possible matchup for Kevin Garnett and I think he got a little bit incoming on its head because he was the opposite personality type and I think he
Rob Kelly 49:42
is trash talk is about Yeah, KGD got you on that one.
Dave Clarke 49:47
He was like what the would have been like he'll kind
Rayshawn Buchanan 49:50
of that's worse. That's worse. Much worse. Yes, you try your hardest. Perhaps you want a bus saying hey, you know next tribe young fella. What? Yeah, the market catches up to He was like, Yo, like, I legit try to bump them five times and legit Tim Duncan did not move. And this is oldest him knocking this is not prime Tim Yeah, but
Dave Clarke 50:07
that's like the old guy the why at that point, you know, it's like he's
Rayshawn Buchanan 50:11
still given. He was still giving people you know, problems and but yeah I just thought he's but to me he's always one guy that if it was Oh, you just put him at six or seven just cuz I'm like he's got five it's got almost 27,000 portion
Dave Clarke 50:26
I didn't put him at 667 No, no, no, no
Rayshawn Buchanan 50:30
obviously obviously had most of those who act like he did like he shouldn't be in that range and I'm just like, wait a minute I
Rob Kelly 50:35
kind of feel like it's the I feel like I feel wrong gets more shifted and doke and man I just feel like you know what I mean? Like?
Rayshawn Buchanan 50:43
I will I think that I think Tim Duncan's was why he didn't go six? Uh, no. But I mean, let's, let's look.
Dave Clarke 50:49
Yeah. But I think that I think that Tim Duncan is more of a victim of the idea of the idea of the San Antonio Spurs and like what they were and how they were constituted, was like, and this is why they want it's like it was pop in the system and the team and it wasn't about any individual player. And I think that that's why their individual accolades at Robinson, like Tim Duncan, there's arguments to be made that manage nobly and Manu Parker Yeah. And Tony Parker, like maybe wouldn't have been as good anywhere else, you know, like people. I think I think that that's a pretty legitimate take, to be honest with you. I think that that pop made, he played Moneyball a little bit in some of those positions. And I think that I think that that's a little bit why Tim doesn't get the credit he deserves because he wasn't an individualist. You know, he was he was there to help the team. And I think he deserves credit for that. But when we're talking about basketball and individual athletes, I think that's what happens. Listen, I'm really happy about two things. I'm happy that because we're at a time, we didn't have to talk about Kyrie Irving go into the math. Oh, that's a huge,
Rob Kelly 51:50
that's a huge I want to I want to talk about us putting our balls on the net face. All right. Well, I'll give
Dave Clarke 51:55
you guys a choice. We have two subjects that we didn't get to, and I don't really want to talk about either of them. But we can either talk about Kyrie Irving getting traded to the Mavs or we could talk about the fucking KD rumors again. So which one do you guys
Rob Kelly 52:08
carry? I'm so sick of those KD or I'm so sick of those. Thank you.
Dave Clarke 52:12
Okay, love it. So the question I'll lead off with is, does it take six months, 12 months or 18 months for Kyrie Irving to be the worst thing to happen to the Dallas Mavericks in the last 10 years?
Rob Kelly 52:23
I'll give him I'll give him three months. I'll go s three months. I think they have I think they have a couple of good games. I think there's gonna be a game where him and Luca both score 40 points and it's awesome.
Dave Clarke 52:36
Okay, that's my next question.
Rob Kelly 52:37
They bought me a ball. Right, exactly. But the thing is, when it comes down to not crunch time in the playoffs, like you can't alternate back and forth like that. We saw that with the fucking Celtics. We know the path that this drives down man. And someone's gonna get mad, Kyrie is gonna have some bad games? I don't. I'm kind of excited to watch a few. I'm excited to see it. I'm not gonna lie. I'm excited to see it. Yeah, to fucking dumpster fire over there in Brooklyn, right. From a basketball standpoint,
Dave Clarke 53:05
do you make that trade? Do you like I don't think that I don't think the second best player down in Dallas was as good as Kyrie Irving like, skill wise, but this is a conversation we always have about him. I think they improved their second best player on down. But I mean, from a basketball standpoint, like how does this work?
Rob Kelly 53:24
I have a follow up for you to re partner on that. Do you think Kyrie can still be the Kyrie he was with Brian and Cleveland? That's what they want. Right? That's what they want is
Rayshawn Buchanan 53:34
this this will be he will look like Cleveland carry because Lucas game is similar to LeBron. So don't have moments when he hits the big shot for him because Luca will carry on for two quarters like bronze to carry them and then Kyrie will take over and the fourth. I think about that game, he said, It's only when he had 57. I think about the 49 he had to get stuck in game four. And 2017.
Rob Kelly 53:57
He's talking miss that night, couldn't you?
Rayshawn Buchanan 54:00
Yeah, he's been torched whenever he wants to be. And yes, we're not speaking about what he says and does off the court on the court. When he's locked in. And he's been locked in when he's been on the court for the most part this year. When he's locked in. He's dangerous still. And you still make that trade. Boston made that trade years ago. Cleveland was right with drafting him number one years ago in 2011. But it wasn't gonna do Derrick Williams or and his cancer could have those those limbo right right behind him. So let's be let's be rope. So yeah, they made the right decision. And I think that you're right, they're gonna have moments when they score 40 Plus and you're like, Whoa, this team can do something in the playoffs. The reason why I don't think it's gonna be a three month thing would already be three months is if he says I'm out of here I'm gonna go which which is within his right, however, because Dallas will now own his bird rights. Yeah, I think you get money. So I'm thinking and Mark Cuban will pay you pay Chris as presenters. He's paid Luca.
Rob Kelly 55:00
Like if he if he believes you thought he paid Chandler Parsons.
Rayshawn Buchanan 55:03
Hey PHL shirt dad surgeon so he's going to give money frivolously like, that's just what he does. So I'm pretty sure I'll go with the 12 months to 18 months because it's gonna be okay. I got I've signed on the dotted line, regardless of movie or not they have to pay that contract. So yeah, I think that that's what ends up happening. I think it'd be cool for him to learn from Jason Kidd as well. Someone who was, you know, the best point guard in his day, in my opinion. So yeah, I think that he's going to be excited to watch
Dave Clarke 55:32
what's his day though, because I personally, like what's his area? I'm taking now and I remember Jason Kidd, so I don't know if you're like,
Rayshawn Buchanan 55:40
I'm sure I don't know what it was all of our foot but I get that but I mean, as a as a pure point guard like it's not close to JC busy
Dave Clarke 55:47
learning from Jason Kidd at this point is crazy going like let me take
Rob Kelly 55:51
like worries that we're gonna share from anyone bro. You
Dave Clarke 55:53
can I think it sucks.
Rayshawn Buchanan 56:00
Jason Kidd is just this is not it once again. He'd been Steve Nash Yosei I don't know Steve Nash went back through every piece and had all of him through I get that. I think Jayson his temperament is different. And Steve Nash, obviously, I think that he won't have an issue getting Academy space if he needs to be I know that we see him as this like, mini carry. We see him as the guy that can't be approached, but, um, but so I told you off off the air like I just met him a few weeks ago for the game. When Brooklyn came here. Just it's a facade on TV. He's really laid back. He really is. He's laid back. He's so like, I don't know, maybe he was a good spirits today. I don't know. But he's, he
Dave Clarke 56:38
has he has fucked up teams.
Rob Kelly 56:41
But he's got he's got he's super chill until until until you're like, Kyrie I know, you're really chill. How about you know, this contract extension? And we just say, you know, you got to win the championship to get the max or, like,
Rayshawn Buchanan 56:53
right, no facts, but he still wants to benefit of he can say all you want about the NBA what they haven't done it, but they will they will do at the end of the day. Him and many other players have liked us in the league. They still want that benefit financially from the league. So he's going he's going to fall in line by his standards. To get that next deal for Mark Cuban, can you be rest assured they get back to the conference finals, which is very likely, I think they need to go get the outcome from Toronto. That would be a phenomenal deal. Not only does the defendant missing out the playmaker for them so
Dave Clarke 57:29
good. He'd been good on anything. I
Rob Kelly 57:30
mean, I just wasn't sure
Rayshawn Buchanan 57:31
but I mean, just just for that, but how they want to move the ball. He's not gonna He's not someone that needs the ball to be effective. So I think that would be phenomenal for for them. Yeah. So I just think that that's the case. So and they're also chopping Christian woods. So Mr. Brad Stevens, get on the phone. Because Chris Sherwood is exactly what Dave has been looking for what I believe him
Dave Clarke 57:54
and one second was really good. So I'd rather see outcome actually, if we're talking
Rob Kelly 57:59
about so. Yeah, we so happy I just want to I just want to bring up a couple of things about Kyrie first in the notes. But more Kyrie, is I sent some articles earlier, where it's like, listen, there's gonna be points, where we're gonna see articles and is gonna be this match team is the next best thing. Listen, we've all been through this with Kyrie before. This is like that dude, who keeps robbing your friends, but you keep bringing them to the party. He's like, Nah, bro. Wait, he's, he's, he's okay. Now, he's okay. But then also his ship goes missing again. You're like, God fucking David do like, this is it's it's he'll He'll never change. He will never change. Right?
Dave Clarke 58:43
I agree with you. I do agree with you. And I do feel like I'm stepping on a rake here. But like, after listening to Ray like, I just wanted to hear your guys's thoughts on this and like, after listening to Ray like, like, I'm ready to be heard again. I feel like i i All of a sudden they have like the best but like He's not wrong. I know. I always do this. Listen, I know I
Rob Kelly 59:04
always we had a pod evitable it is it I know. No. Hear me out. Hear me what's gonna end I
Dave Clarke 59:10
understand that we had a podcast when he went to Brooklyn, right? Like I get that. And I understand that. I was very vocal about the idea that him and Kevin Durant, and I was on your side, man. I was sad about that. And I think you know, Ray had a lot of good points about how they all just have a sick amount of good players in Brooklyn now and it's obviously going to work and it was a failure. I understand. I was wrong about that. Right. I was wrong. But I think that the day might have the best backcourt in the NBA in Dallas right now. And I think my talent they do they really do. And like Luca Hi, how can I be rich and moan all year about how it's crazy that Luca doesn't have anybody with him? That's any fucking good. Because he's, he's probably the MVP
Rob Kelly 59:56
so so I just like just go through who carries Should played with though. Oh, in his trail of unhappiness, right? So he started with LeBron. Not happy. I don't want to be the partner anymore. I want to go to Boston. Oh, look, we got Jayson Tatum and Jaylen Brown, who are up and coming in now top five players in the NBA wasn't happy there, bounced, left went to Brooklyn, played with Kevin Durant and James Harden. And the historic big three, the best team we've ever seen play basketball when they're healthy. It was It was unbelievable to watch. Still couldn't succeed. And you're gonna tell me Lucas being gonna be different?
Dave Clarke 1:00:35
Yeah, no, I think it's probably gonna be it's gonna be a ton of fun. Like this insane. I honestly just think that stylistically, he hasn't played with a guy since LeBron, that all of Ray's points I think are true. Like, I think if just this once he could not be a client, he really could have success in Dallas. And it's kind of a no lose bet, you know, because like, if Dallas fails, I mean, I'll be a little bit bummed for Luca because I like him a lot as a player. And, and I want him to be successful. I like to Mavericks as an organization, too. I mean, I don't have anything against them. But I will be so sick if they were sick, right.
Rob Kelly 1:01:11
On the flip side, on the flip side, the Brooklyn Nets may be the worst run organization in the last 10 years in the NBA when I know they've made it to the playoffs. They've done this, they've done that, bro, when you think about the timeline of events between the Celtics and fucking nets
Dave Clarke 1:01:29
basketball, I would imagine like like Orlando fans are not like super happy right now. Rather like
Rob Kelly 1:01:36
but, but also, the promise hasn't always been there throw away though, right, Brooklyn, Brooklyn has gone all in and been the championship team like four times in the last decade it has cratered every fucking time.
Dave Clarke 1:01:52
What about trust the process the like if we're talking about Hi we're talking about high profile failures in big markets
Rob Kelly 1:01:58
but they see the funny thing is about all this with the net is they were trusting the process and they were on the way to be talking about the six laws I know you are I know but I'm just saying the nets were moving in the right direction before they did this KD Kyrie and hardened thing they had no Russell get
Dave Clarke 1:02:18
rid of that core was crazy that that core before they arrived like like jared allen like why do you get rid of Jared out r&d And that's crazy.
Rob Kelly 1:02:27
Who else was it was jared allen and was they trade?
Rayshawn Buchanan 1:02:30
I got you know so it was
Dave Clarke 1:02:34
so corrosive hurt which is wild which is wild
Rayshawn Buchanan 1:02:37
like the guy who just got back into Dell pen was nobody who was the best backup guard behind carry they had unbelievable and unreal. So so you're brave back Dinwiddie you met just
Dave Clarke 1:02:49
KD and those guys right now they would be like they would be in top three in the NBA team without that well
Rayshawn Buchanan 1:02:55
during during your Finney Smith to me is an interesting piece right? I think I liked finish him at him every So Neil will be able to guard most wings on every night. Except the two guys in Boston, but they had never
Dave Clarke 1:03:08
really gotten most wings. My husband Yeah,
Rayshawn Buchanan 1:03:10
just yeah, just being on so there. That's a really good tandem, in my opinion. What on paper right now, once again, if Katie says, you know, I'll finish up the year. If it's Durant, Royce Dinwiddie during unfinished Smith and then Nick class then the next year five, and you still got Patty Mills, you still gotta sit like they actually still have a team that should still be top five knees still. Wait once again if say Mr. Simpson was me wherever I would say you're supposed to be. And I'm being funny when I'm saying it could be clearly as I've been. But have you had those guys there? You should still be a tough five on because you still have to all stars on your team. And once again, that's not an opinion. That's a fact. So if that's the case, you should still be able to get the job done. At least it gets to the first maybe even a second round and then you handle what you need to handle from there in my opinion.
Rob Kelly 1:04:01
What else is also the fact is that where the nets fucking daddies so it doesn't matter what they do. They can be top five, they can be whatever. For the last 10 years. We've literally owned and they've envied us and they wish they were us. This isn't a rivalry guys. We have we have traded with them and dominated the trades. We have literally built our championship Corp. Our our best duo ever came from the nets. And then we we we we gave you our our chi V curse and put it onto the nets and you guys thought you were gonna win championship. We told you guys we told you and here we are. That's not
Dave Clarke 1:04:46
really an argument that needs to be made. I mean, at the end of the day, I know I'm gonna sound like a smoke fog but the Celtics rivals the Lakers. It is always the Lakers. It's always going to be the Lakers. We don't have rivals other than them, you know? If you're Brooklyn, you want to sell things to your rivals, because that raises your credibility, to be quite honest with you.
Rayshawn Buchanan 1:05:06
I mean, you're fighting in their own city man. Like, I don't I don't know When Mikhail Robin said his name wrong but whatever. He's not there anymore but I don't know what their what their idea was like, I get it, they brought the wrong way it was over there.
Dave Clarke 1:05:20
It didn't make any sense, though. Because it was like, Okay, I don't see anything will make this good will pay anything then it was like, I don't want to pay the luxury tax. And then it's like, well, what do you do?
Rayshawn Buchanan 1:05:30
Let's fit them in Atlantic Avenue, which is already busy as is, you know, beautiful or green or whatever. Like, my mom was a fan. She's like, I want to go see Mary J. Blige at the Bartlett that was great. Like, you're a great mom, but it's just like, they have a nice arena. But it's like, like, other than that, it's just like, okay, you know, then you have a good breakfast over there. My favorite brunch restaurant called Woodlawn that they they took that away after the pandemic, so I'm already I was already mad at
Rob Kelly 1:05:57
brunch spots on us, bro. You dropping brunch spot arose right now it's no different podcast.
Rayshawn Buchanan 1:06:09
You never know what you're here better. But no, this thing. They should have just stayed in Newark at the Prudential Center, you know, playing over there. And I did from a marketing standpoint that had been better. But listen as bad whether they're good or bad, or anything in between. The Knicks will always run on your iPhone. So under you know, they haven't won in 50 years either. So the Nick
Dave Clarke 1:06:33
but I was just gonna say the Knicks New York, New York so hard that like they don't have to be good ever. They don't have to be good. And people still
Rayshawn Buchanan 1:06:43
go I wanna I want to remind those Knicks fans that you're celebrating something y'all want 15 years ago. Well, y'all did a whole documentary of when the garden was eating. He talked about 1970 and in 1973 gave the Bush era Jerry Lucas Willis Reed ply Fraser out a pearl, they're not coming to your fucking door either. So I just say that for the Knicks fans that have been
Dave Clarke 1:07:06
there they're not on our level either. Like
Rayshawn Buchanan 1:07:10
I just had it I don't know. Because that someone will be also shit with me. So I didn't make sure that I put that out there on here to be honest,
Dave Clarke 1:07:18
if there's if there's any team and ease that the subjects are historic rival rivals with on any level, it's the Sixers
Rob Kelly 1:07:24
and no hate.
No, they're not sure.
Rayshawn Buchanan 1:07:30
I mean, for me from 2010 all short.
Dave Clarke 1:07:34
I'm just talking about like franchise to franchise like they're not they don't come near as like maybe Philly does, maybe. But there's nobody in these that like can touch his inspection of the Brooklyn Nets of course wherever
Rob Kelly 1:07:46
Patty Mills Boston.
Dave Clarke 1:07:50
Okay. All right, settle down. It's just like it's actually
Rayshawn Buchanan 1:07:54
really good here. Actually. What?
Rob Kelly 1:07:56
Yeah, no, I really like Patty mills. That was welcome.
Dave Clarke 1:08:00
All right, on that note, that was a good show. I really enjoyed talking basketball with you guys again. Obviously, we're gonna be heating up. Come in coming down the stretch. All Star break. We're definitely gonna talk about that. Can't wait for the all star Bamix. So we're really excited for the All Star Weekend this this season. I'm interested. I
Rob Kelly 1:08:17
Dave Clarke 1:08:18
I hope I hope he does some i Oh, I would say I would love to see Jaylen Brown. Maybe try out some cool. Could Jaylen Brown be good to dunk competition? I don't know that'd be sick I think because like he's athletics book that'd be sweet.
Rob Kelly 1:08:31
Remember when Tatum won the skills competition or and a half court shot that was fun?
Dave Clarke 1:08:35
Yeah, I was sick I mean, I think I still think my all time favorite moment of the all star game is Paul piers being like I'm winning the three point competition and everyone being like yeah, whatever Paul it him being like No, no, I'm doing it and then he goes out and does it and it was fucking awesome. So all that or was that the same year Rondo was like that. Did that edit game a horse?
Rayshawn Buchanan 1:08:53
Like so. Choose from the rafters and there's one in 2010 and then that horse thing was an issue with him doing that was pretty dope. Right? Right. Right. That was with that though. That was pretty dope. That was Londo. You can make shots outside of the fucking TV.
Dave Clarke 1:09:08
Anyway, on that note, I know everyone's excited. We haven't talked basketball in a while but we will do it again soon because tomorrow here I'm missing the point we're recording our Super Bowl preview show because it is the juice of football season so please do if you're done listening to this and you haven't listed yet please do this and of that. So for all my friends we're missing the point. The real BK Bob Kelly Hollywood Rayshawn Buchanan and LeBron James. I'm really sorry about everything I said. I was just playing. Have a good night, everybody.
Examining Kyrie Trade, LeBron Record & NBA Trade Deadline: