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Dec. 1, 2021

Will anyone make the Baseball Hall of Fame this year? Patriots biggest threat.

Will anyone make the Baseball Hall of Fame this year? Patriots biggest threat.

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On this episode of MTP: After the first few ballots for this year's Baseball Hall of Fame class have been revealed, Mike and Dave discus if players like David Ortiz and Alex Rodriguez will get in on their first ballot, or will they be marked with scarlet letters like Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens, amongst others.

Next, with the New England Patriots in possession of one of the top seeds in the AFC, we talk about which teams in the NFL pose the biggest threats to the Patriots path to a potential 7th Super Bowl Title.

Finally, we go through the Week 13 NFL Power Rankings and Dave goes on an epic rant on Aaron Rodgers
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Hosts: Michael Marcangelo, Dave Clarke
Producer: Craig D'Alessandro

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Transcript
Craig D'Alessandro:

On this episode of MTP we discuss we think anyone will be elected to the Baseball Hall of Fame this year, the Patriots back near the top of the mountain in the AFC and we'll go through the week 13 Power Rankings after another wild and unpredictable week in the NFL. This is missing the point, Episode 98. But it's all relative

Dave Clarke:

I did my research like, like, like someone who's against the vaccine, I Googled three things and now I think those things that's that's doing your research, no peer reviewed studies for me. Um, so I, I mean, I feel like they're just not gonna bring anybody in again for like the million fear in a row. Right? Because the ballot is so gross. And it's so controversial. So I mean, for me, it's like the a rod question always these fans like him because of his scorched earth policy when he was, you know what he got caught doing steroids in the first place. He was such a little bitch out of the entire thing. Well, you can kind of like as much as like David Ortiz, and we all love David Ortiz. But as much as he as much as he embodies this, the character of baseball a little bit more like he also popped like ivy. Is that the rule? Are we gonna put Are we allowed to put people who got popper steroids in the hall of fame or not? Like what's the what's the deal? I personally don't give a shit. I'd love to hear your take on it.

Michael Marcangelo:

Yeah, alright, so I've, uh, I have a really wide range of emotions on this topic. So, you know, this is the final year that Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens will appear on the Hall of Fame ballot. I care about I care about worthwile Hall of Famers? I think Curt Schilling was a Hall of Fame postseason pitcher. Also a

Dave Clarke:

massive content real life, right. Like just very, very much like not a nice person.

Michael Marcangelo:

Yeah, yeah. So right, you know, Barry Bonds. Okay, so I'm just gonna walk you through Barry Bonds. Roger Clemens is also a prick. But again, let's just let's just do this on the merits of getting into the Hall of Fame. So, Mike, my hot take is that if those two guys are not in Cooperstown, it's not a real Hall of Fame. And I'm going to frame it as this everyone believes that Barry Bonds started really juicing, or actually just started juicing after 1998 with the hysteria of Mark McGwire and Sammy Sosa

Dave Clarke:

right, and also because he was tiny and then became enormous.

Michael Marcangelo:

You have it that that transformation happened that offseason. Right.

Dave Clarke:

Right, because of steroids.

Michael Marcangelo:

But in August of 1998, Barry Bonds became the only member of the 400 home runs 400. stolen base club.

Dave Clarke:

Okay, I have a I have a point about this book continued.

Michael Marcangelo:

That in and of itself is is ridiculous. And, you know, he saw the fact that in the locker room when people were covering that achievement, he said, and I quote, I've got nine writers standing here. McGuire had 200 writers in his face when he hit 30 home runs this year. So he saw He saw the writing on the wall, right? Like that's that's what was happening. He was the guy's a 14 time All Star 298 hitter. I mean, 400 home runs with four steroids. And in the next 10 years, he I think he had another 362 right to finish off with what 760 to you. He's the all time home run leader. Also, let's not forget, he's the all time walks leader, and it's not close. He has Rickey Henderson but like 400 walks. It's ridiculous. Yeah, that guy should be in the Hall of Fame. I can pause before I go to mark before I go to Roger Clemens or

Dave Clarke:

whatever happened to like the the the asterisk argument, like is that not a thing we're doing? I agree with you those numbers, those numbers completely justify three, pre giant next to Barry Bonds, the numbers justify him being in the Hall of Fame. And I also agree with you that like, it's very difficult to explain, if you were like explaining baseball to somebody that knew nothing about it. It's very difficult, difficult to go. So this guy with all these stats, that's number one in all these categories, probably the most important scoring categories. You know, like walks in and homeruns and like hits I'm sure he's pretty high in hits, too. i It's hard to explain why that person is not in the Hall of Fame. And I do think it's sort of discredited. Can't you just be like, Okay, we're inducting Barry Bonds up until 1998 into the Hall of Fame. But like somehow clarify that the remaining Barry Bonds juicing part

Michael Marcangelo:

doesn't count. Sure. Yeah, I'll just

Dave Clarke:

read when you're like here he is Barry Bonds 400 home runs like read off his stats like up until he clearly started putting anabolic steroids in his in his in his pooper.

Michael Marcangelo:

So 400 home runs 400 stolen bases the only member of that club at that point in time and he and he was an eight time all star or no sorry, eight time MVP at that at that point. All right. I was right the

Dave Clarke:

broke but it's broken but it's broke. It's a broken system. Sure. But I said the start because they basically they go okay, sorry. We didn't induct enough people from like, or anyone from the Negro League, we're gonna make up for that. Great. Now we're done putting people in the Hall of Fame. And like that now they've sort of backed themselves into this, this corner that you're describing, where there's a bunch of guys on the ballot, most notably, like we're talking about Barry Bonds, where it's like, you're gonna run out of time to put him in, and then you're gonna, you're gonna end if you're the Baseball Hall of Fame. Now, they obviously the Baseball Hall of Fame, being a strange separate entity from baseball is a factor here. Like it's kind of different in Canton. Um, it's sort of like one entity, but like, the PR for them has always been a little bit different. It's been about the prestige and the character of baseball, they don't want to get like, you know, they don't they don't want to get their hall of fame sullied by, by by steroid users being in there, but what you're saying, which I think is a good point is your health is fucked. It's very partisan in there. I mean,

Michael Marcangelo:

if you're going to leave them out on the character and and and whatever clause it is, then you should remove every known vocal racist from the hall of fame to regardless of when they played, right, because you can't judge character based on the fact that

Dave Clarke:

content data integrity slash narrator says sportsmanship class

Michael Marcangelo:

that they so so. So in reality, I'll move on to Clements right. So he was suspected of roids in 2004. Perfect. Pre 2004. Roger Clemens was 310 wins 160 losses with a 3.15 era. That is a Hall of Fame career. But there just isn't. I don't understand how and the writers that have ballots in their in their hands are often the ones that say, you know, very bars is all famer before you steroids. So put them in? Yeah, right.

Dave Clarke:

What but I'm just I'm confused what happened to this book. I remember this whole asterisk conversation going on for so long. And I don't understand like, can't we just, well, can we just cover why isn't it in the best interest of the Baseball Hall of Fame to compromise here? Yeah.

Michael Marcangelo:

So his bat is the bat that he used to hit the, you know, the all time leading homerun record that's in the Hall of Fame with a little asterisk next to next to it. All the stuff. All their memorabilia is in there. But they're not in there. They're not in shrine in that hall. Which you don't even have to be a huge baseball fan. Like if you ever have the chance to go to Cooperstown to see it. It's pretty cool. Right? When you walk in there, like you just know it. This is something awesome. But I think what really, what really upsets me the most and leave it you know, we're we have a renaissance Patriot scene going on right now. Right, which we'll talk about I'm sure and I'm not over here pissing and moaning about two Hall of Famers that are going to get in. Joe Tory and Tony Lucerne. Tony La Russa built. I mean, literally, the road to the Hall of Fame for Tony La Russa was paved by Mark McGuire and Jose Conseco to Reuters to people that helped him win a World Series in Oakland. He then followed Mark McGuire, to to St. Louis. Right, Albert Bluehost. Maybe he didn't maybe he didn't. I really don't care. Scott Rolen probably did it too. He wanted series.

Dave Clarke:

But my point, this is my point of of how I originally started off because you have kind of like 40s in a Ron, who are first year ballot guys now, right? I think they're both have their first year this year. And it's like, our eligibility wise. And it's like, we're just gonna continue down this path of this same conversation over and over and over again. Because it's like, the first thing I think of is like, Oh, well, the whole Iraq thing. And I'm realizing, you know, you bring up like shilling in bonds and stuff. It's like, oh, shit, yeah, we've been having this conversation for like, a number of years and years, and we're gonna go through the same thing over and over again. And it's like, it's just gonna be criminal every single time because like to me, so say, like, Oh, David Ortiz, where it's his last year of eligibility for David Ortiz, like zoom ahead. We're having the same fucking conversation. They haven't decided like on the criteria basically, still, the whole Baseball Hall of Fame has like, lost its credibility at this point. Because, you know, you can make the argument David Ortiz hangs out with drug dealers in the Dominican Republic, you know, it's like, okay, like, I don't know, dude, like, why does that matter? Like, what is this? I don't understand this, like old British royal family like polo playing. Just chalk it up to an era Dude, it is what it is. That's what everyone else is doing. Everyone else has kind of moved on. And also the elephant in the room. That was like the funnest time to watch baseball ever. It's like

Michael Marcangelo:

Sorry. If you want to book the real elephant in the room, TK, Bud Seelig is in the commissioner of the league when all of this was happening,

Dave Clarke:

is it right? That right there is just like that. You're condoning it. Yeah.

Michael Marcangelo:

Right. So I, you know, I love I love David Ortiz. I love everything he did for the city of Boston. He was a DH. He didn't really play first base when he was prominent, so he all he had to do is hit and shore. He probably took PDS, but he's going to get in because he's a media darling. Very Barnes was an asshole always an episode.

Dave Clarke:

That's the difference though, right? Like if you take these two first year, guys, a rod and Ortiz and it's like, again, it comes back to the credibility of the of the Baseball Hall of Fame here because a rod did everything he could have taught him to talk his way out of the Baseball Hall of Fame. Basically, when he got when he got popped, and he got fined. He still isn't like, sorry, I did steroids. He's like, that whole thing that happened really cost me a lot of money and like reputation. It's like that whole thing that happened. Like, when they ask or tease about it. He just Bill Clinton did. He was like, yeah, maybe it could have happened. Maybe it didn't happen. Could you just sort of like wait until people lose interest and then you're fine. Nobody thinks you're an asshole. If you kick up a fuss, like a rod did different stories. So it's like, what's the criteria there? Because they essentially got caught for the same thing around the same time and the same list of people that got popped right like in the initial thing was a rod a high profile guy because he was a Yankee? Yeah, sure. You can, like take all that stuff into account. Well, based on how they handled it, that's that should should that like as much as I'm like, fucking Rob Porter teasin that shouldn't affect it. That should affect it. Like you should keep it keep you got to keep the requirements consistent. You know? So already, you're just like snowballing with these with these with these things. It's like Dude, if you want to say it was during the Attitude Era of baseball, you never to me, like just it just it is what it is, like, you know, it's how many articles have you read just to like, do a quick analogy. I mean, her articles you read, that are just like snooze bests that are like the Attitude Era, and why it was so problematic. And it's like, yeah, but like, that's why it was also fun. Can we just I know, it's different. And I know it's not wrestling, but it's like, can we just chalk it up to an era and just move on guys? Like, obviously, they were going to be the best players in the MLB regardless? Yeah, like those were still going to be the best guys of that era, regardless of like, how whether they juice or not with Sammy Sosa and Mark McGwire I don't know that's that's up for debate. And also, Sammy Sosa has that other stuff like the bat stuff. And I think that like I think that

Michael Marcangelo:

effect they weren't they weren't Hall of Fame players. Barry Bonds is a seven time Gold

Dave Clarke:

Glove owner. No, I'm with you. I'm with you every step of the way. He holds the record

Michael Marcangelo:

for the most consecutive seasons with over 30 home runs. And just to let you know, that started in 1992, and it went all the way until 2004. So yeah, literally before he was using until after he was using

Dave Clarke:

it was a hell of a bit it was a hell of a base runner to before he put nine pounds of

Michael Marcangelo:

stolen base basis did did noticeably drop off. He went from 37 to 28. Just one year.

Dave Clarke:

That's a lot of Islam were asked to be lugging around. Yeah, yeah. But like

Michael Marcangelo:

this is I think you lose people and and now you just accept the fact that that steroids in baseball happened. Everyone did the ones that didn't and excelled. Great, awesome. You're that much better because everyone else was using. But 1998 That's homerun shares between rewire and Sosa's save the leak. And you're punishing people for doing the things that brought the league back to the forefront of American sports.

Dave Clarke:

Yeah, you can kind of boil it down to one question if you're if you're looking at it from if you and I are sitting in a room when they should put us in these rooms because I really feel like we braintrust this stuff out. Yeah, if you and I are sitting in a room with the Commission to like put people in or out of the hall of fame, you're thinking about a big fake picture, it comes down to one question, what ruins the credibility of your organization, your organization being the Baseball Hall of Fame, not the MLB but your organization being the Baseball Hall of Fame what hurts the credibility of that more putting in guy who did steroids in there or not putting a guy with those numbers in there and I think we're in agreement that the latter is a much more harmful thing to do to baseball to the baseball family to the legacy of the sport because honestly, nobody really gives a shit nobody really gives a shit at this point. And the ones who did um there was a lot of phony outrage in that era too if you remember because there was like it was pretty early that a lot of like actual sports fans were like I don't know dude, let them juice if football I can understand because they might kill each other. I get that

Michael Marcangelo:

but like, you know for Boston fans that are that are our age, right, knowing that everyone was juiced and that all star game and watching Pedro strikeout bonds Sosa and McGwire back to back to back that made you feel that much prouder of paid right maybe he didn't maybe he didn't. But everyone knew what the what the what the score was. Everyone knew that right? Take we're taking steroids, so much so

Dave Clarke:

they look like cartoon characters. It was a secret

Michael Marcangelo:

Then he went out of his way to avoid it until it until the San Francisco Chronicle broke that story about balco back in late 2003. And then all of a sudden, it was 7% of the league tested positive for steroids. That's not that's really not that much.

Dave Clarke:

I would also make the argument. I don't think it's this is this is a murky argument and I it could be picked apart, but I just thought of it. I'm just gonna say it out loud. Loud. I don't know how fair it is to punish a specific player for participating in rampid culture inside their sport. Be just because they excelled. It's not as if there weren't shitty players doing steroids. I mean, like ever still just Bagwell.

Michael Marcangelo:

joseki Aiko? I mean, Jeff Bagwell is in the Hall of Fame. Yeah, what do we do? What are we doing? Yeah,

Dave Clarke:

yeah, you gotta you gotta if you're gonna really even an out if you really gonna do it take all the white guys out that were that were playing with before the Negro League on it. Just take them out. Because obviously they you know, I mean, let's be honest, if we're doing real deep dive on the other Baseball Hall of Fame like those guys deserve to be in they're less than very monsters

Michael Marcangelo:

when I say. So baseball band steroids in our in our standard one didn't test until 1993. Or until 2003.

Dave Clarke:

You will I mean, and who will point is that? are they responsible for the culture? You know what I mean? Like, are they commissioners and and they're let on the teams at what point? are they responsible? Because they did start acting responsible for two years after they

Michael Marcangelo:

made the rule? No, 12 years. 12 sorry, that 19 It was when they banned it. And then they started testing in 2003. So it was like, Hey, don't hate don't do this. But we're not gonna check.

Dave Clarke:

Well, right because it's not even live. The thing is, they were fine with it. It was like Congress got mad and like Katie Couric did an interview with fuckin a rod. And it was like, this is like, a no fair. It's like, Teacher teacher. They're doing steroids. It's like, we all probably would have been cool with it. There was a home run derby that happened to win season, we guys it was amazing.

Michael Marcangelo:

Also, just my last thing on barns, and I probably I didn't know, I was as much of a very Barnes advocate until Until recently, the last year of his career was I think, like 2007, right? The man who had 28 home runs at like 42 years old. And it wasn't and wasn't picked up. Because that was your that he broke the record. San Francisco couldn't cash it on him anymore. So they just released him. And then no one touched him like that is that it is absolutely ridiculous, to not have those two guys. And you can say what you want about them? Personally, I think Roger Clemens is a prick. Right. But as a baseball player, as a pitcher, he's he's one of the best. He's the best pitcher of our era of our lifetime. And one of the best in the history of, of baseball, and he should be there.

Dave Clarke:

Yeah, that's true. And also, you know,

Michael Marcangelo:

put those guys lower

Dave Clarke:

down on these ballot boats that are getting punished because of this debate, this exact debate like Scott Rowland should be in the Hall of Fame. And he was like, by all accounts, a nice guy, and he finished like fifth in the voting. Last time they voted and it was like, Yeah, we're not putting anybody in whatever. And it's like guys like that are getting punished because of this debate. You know, it's like those, those are guys that are credit to the sport. So just put them in there. You know, it's like,

Michael Marcangelo:

also for the for the BB wa writers that that have a ballot and turn in well, that's not that's not sold out. If you send back an empty ballot, I firmly believe that you should relinquish all of RESPA all of your rights to ever cast a

Dave Clarke:

doubt in the future and if you don't want to vote fuck, like don't vote ever. Yeah, yeah, it's um, there's a lot I think there's a lot of cowardice going on. I don't think they want to reignite this this debate to hobby but I honestly think it's just like bite the bullet put those guys in and try to regulate to the point where you don't have an error like that repeat itself because you you have all the you do genuine as much as I say, nobody really gave a shit. You do genuinely have actual consequences to your sport later on down the line. And I just think it's, yeah, it's just it's a bummer. But let's see what happens. Let's see what happens. Maybe they'll do the right thing. Probably not. Maybe try to be an optimist. Should we move on to the National Football League? Do you want to talk about your I do want to talk about your resurgent New England Patriots? Yeah,

Michael Marcangelo:

I mean, on it,

Dave Clarke:

there's so fun to watch Mike. Oh, my God is like, oh, that's entertainment baby. Greatest Show on Earth. The Patriots are gonna win a game one yard at a time.

Michael Marcangelo:

I mean, but they just look at this. I think I said this a couple weeks ago. It just feels like the path is opening up for them. Like this feels like your typical like 2010 2011 team. You know, obviously like what you don't

Dave Clarke:

mind me the 2001 2002 team to be quite honest with you. I mean, maybe I'm doing maybe I'm doing like don't do that radiate Brady. The Brady stuff, but it's like, that is how but that is how we that is how he ran the office that back then, you know, it was all like Corey Dillon and like short little like, pop throw over the over the middle and like you know the skill players were kind of a little bit more spread out across the field and it was like just like a well run special teams and like a well run, bend, don't break defense. And also your defense has elite players on it again, parallel back to like, Oh 102 You have like you had elite players that may be necessary not necessarily are like household names, but there's enough elite players where you haven't overall really good defense. You really don't see the comparison.

Michael Marcangelo:

Well, okay, so I'm

Dave Clarke:

not saying you're gonna go on another 20 chickens to die at some point. Especially with this many people wishing for it to happen, but like, but like, I'm just saying just just just on paper is how they run their team. It seems similar.

Michael Marcangelo:

What I said that like when I say like, I think that this feels like a 2010 2011 team just because the way that the path is clearing up. I mean, the rest of the league like the rest of the league is just so stupid. Everyone else sucks. Yeah, but but just think about it like Derrick Henry out. We can be Ryan Tannehill we've always been able to be just Ryan Tannehill I you know, the 1000s game would have been a trap game. Had you had Calvin Ridley Cordell Patterson, but they're all gone. Baker Mayfield out DECA he was he was shipped out like everything is falling into place for the Patriots has to literally, you know, win 11 games. Yeah, even this week again, you know, going up against the bills. That's a huge game.

Dave Clarke:

Well, I mean, let's let's look forward to what your playoff picture looks like. Who are you afraid of? In the AFC? Are you afraid of buffalo

Michael Marcangelo:

at this point? Now? So do I put do I think Buffalo was a better team than us? Like, do they have more talent? Yes. But they're not putting together this year. Yeah. And also, like, they just lost their number one quarter to like a knee injury for the rest of the year. Again, it's just the path opening up. And the Patriots

Dave Clarke:

in this organization is the exact kind of organization that sees that and will take advantage of it. And Bill Belichick is the guy that could take advantage of it. As its said, the more you talk, and the more I think about the more sad I get

Michael Marcangelo:

themes that I'm afraid of in the AFC the Ravens you're not afraid of. Now I know because I mean, we beat Ramar last year.

Dave Clarke:

Are you still aren't what like what? Who? I mean, the chiefs?

Michael Marcangelo:

Yeah, yes. Because as bad as that defense was for the first eight weeks, they've gotten a little bit better. And Mac kid get into a pissing contest with Patrick mahomes.

Dave Clarke:

Even Patrick mahomes is like low key asked this year, though. Don't you think? Like he's just not doing that, like Patrick mahomes thing?

Michael Marcangelo:

I mean, they've won like five straight.

Dave Clarke:

Yeah, well, it just doesn't quite look like the same thing that he was doing last year. Like, like, I don't even really blame her for the Superbowl. I feel like there was a lot of drops. You know, I feel like people weren't really doing a lot of favors. I just feel like he's spent a little off like and I think it all comes from him. Like whatever's been going on with them. It comes from him. He

Michael Marcangelo:

also had to run 180 yards behind the line of scrimmage just to just to throw a ball or get a hit. He had no offensive line. It's terrible. Yeah, I you know, the AFC it's, it's the chiefs. And then yeah, it's really I mean, I'm, I fear John Harbaugh. I don't fear Lamar Jackson, like coming into your house. I mean, I mean, he's, he's beat us here.

Dave Clarke:

I mean, like, I said, You fear him like he's under your bed at night.

Michael Marcangelo:

He's like, it seems like you're pretty sweet dude. But, you know, he has no problem coming in to Foxborough and BTS in the playoffs. He did it with Brady. But so like, he doesn't, he doesn't apologize.

Dave Clarke:

But that team, like it's just like Lamar is not that

Michael Marcangelo:

guy. Is he better than Joe Flacco?

Dave Clarke:

I think so. I think it's differently. I think there's nuance to that question, because it's like Joe Flacco was like, Joe Flacco had like, an unbelievable playoffs that year, like overalls. He like more talented, more athletic. Yeah. But like, you have to remember that like, as much as it was kind of like, it was kind of fake. And we all knew that he wasn't that good. And he didn't get deserve the contract he got. He did have a crazy good playoffs that year. Like he was playing really, really well. It's not like he played bad and they won. Lamar is not playing well. Right

Michael Marcangelo:

now. They beat us in oh nine in the wildcard round. They beat us they should have beat us in 2011. If liegt if we ever just catches that, that touchdown or Philly kind of doesn't miss a 28 yard field goal. And then they beat us in 2012

Dave Clarke:

They're not missing field goals these days. I'll tell ya, so they,

Michael Marcangelo:

my my my point is I don't think that team or that organization fears us. So yeah, I think they're the only scary team left

Dave Clarke:

where you can manage your The thing is you can manage your way through a playoffs. You know what I mean? It's a it's a one of those like, I know it's a cliche, but it's a take it one game at a time I play who's put in front of you, scheme for them. Like I just feel like it's like, there was a point leading up to last year's Super Bowl where the Kansas City she seemed invincible. Like they seem like gods there was just nothing you could do. Nobody seems like that right now. So that means everybody's got a shot. And I think in years and I mean this in all sports in years where everyone looks a little shitty. It's always the smartest team that wins. It's always the team that just like game plans really well. And like just manages their way through each game. Now, by the time you get to the Super Bowl, I think anything could happen. Like it could be like so say for example the Patriots even though they had a tough start, I always said it's about who it's about who enters the playoffs hot to, you know, it's like they're entering the playoffs. If they keep this up for the next few weeks. They're entering the playoffs on a on a heater, which is like a huge momentum thing. When you get to the Super Bowl. There's a murderer's row of teams that you could possibly meet. It's like oh, the Patriots did really good. They played the I don't know how that standings are just like they played the Ravens in the AFC Championship game and they won by like the last minute field on their like on a heater. Enter the fucking Arizona Cardinals game plan for them Bill Belichick like I dare you. You're like as good of a coach as he is like, I don't even think they know what they're gonna do. And but they seem to be able to put it together because it just like pure talent. You know, it's like I if I were you guys, I wouldn't want to see them. Like the Packers seem to be able to just get it done. I'm not really sure. You're not scared of them.

Michael Marcangelo:

No, only because you still don't.

Dave Clarke:

Rodgers is the guy. Yeah,

Michael Marcangelo:

sure. Aaron Rodgers has wanted to win Super Bowls. It's great. He's terrible in the playoffs? I mean, he he just chokes he always does. He always does it, isn't it? Like that's not a prediction. It's just history. You know, I mean, so at this point in the NFC here that the here would be the teams that have that I would really fear Tampa. So yes, yes. type of well kinda. It looked it looked like the moment was a little bit too big for him when he when he came back to Foxborough a

Dave Clarke:

moment has ever been too big for Tom fucking Brady. That's ridiculous. Man has been the more syllables than I have like taking leaks in my toilet. It's like absolutely ludicrous. Fucking he's made for the moment.

Michael Marcangelo:

I don't want to I don't like position that I just put myself into argue that there has been a moment that's too big for Tom Brady. But Tom Brady. Tom Brady did say that the 2001 AFC Championship game against the Steelers that moment was too big for him. And he was glad not glad that he got injured. But he was glad to do this

Dave Clarke:

like fucking 11 years old. And that was before he like started drinking baby's blood and doing all that weird shit that he does to like, be Tom Brady yet doesn't count. He's like, they're like, Hey, Tom. Like that's like an interview question. It's like, what would you say your biggest, biggest weaknesses are? Sometimes I care too much. It's very time When was the moment too big for you? When I was a fucking child in NFL terms like to show weakness like that? I think. I think he he came back into I don't think it's any mental thing. He came back into Fox for I think gameplan. And I think obviously Bill Belichick is a very good coach. I think he knows Tom Brady's tendencies better than anyone else on the planet. And I think that he's a very creative coach and he does things that are like very unexpected, even and even his players, it's difficult for them to predict so I don't think Brady could do back to him what he was doing to Tom but I also think if they played again tomorrow, I think the Booker's chances to win goes up like 50 times over because Brady gonna look at you.

Michael Marcangelo:

And you know, to Craig's point, if crocs there, but that's the thing like

Dave Clarke:

God was still having that conversation. What a ludicrous time to be alive. It's like what am I bucket 23 again? Yeah, man it's just about if Grace healthy like I don't know

Michael Marcangelo:

that's crazy. The ramps there Yeah, they scare me. Oh,

Dave Clarke:

come on, dude. Come on, bro. Get out of here with that we just have

Michael Marcangelo:

to not not because Gafford not because of Stafford though but because of that that defects are offensive that the pages offensive line isn't great. And they can la can create an immense amount of opportunities for pass rush I

Dave Clarke:

take your difference. Fuck it. Absolutely Tonks. Those guys. I think that offense is like it's it's all fucked up. I don't think it's OB Jays fault that they haven't won in three games. But I think it's due it was I forgot they played like right after you got traded there. And he like basically had been there for like 12 hours. And he started running routes. And it was like clear that they just weren't hooking up and it was like, okay, cool. Like what's Alright, well, like, you know, we'll review the playbook and we'll do some game tape and he actually had a better game last weekend. Um, the problem is, it's there is a little bit of a, like, an unbalancing of humors. There now, I think, yeah, because it's like, yeah, you have a nice balance. You know, you can go to Cooper cup, and I know that injuries aside, but it's a no to Cooper cup. You can go over here, you can do that and give it to Henderson, like handed off to Henderson Jr. A couple times, whatever. Now, it's like you there's the obj factor, you know, it's like, Alright, we gotta we gotta get it try and get in the fucking ball because he needs usage. You know what I mean? He's just one of those players. I don't know, man. That's the exact kind of thing Bill Belichick is like licking his fucking lips for you know what I mean? It's like, Yeah, let's force the ball to Odell Beckham. Let's make him beat us. Like, let's let's make it weird. You know, like, Let's chop him up at the line. Like, Yeah, fuck it. Well, we did a couple of short yardage pass interference calls just to like ring his bell a couple of times. Like that's the kind of stuff that Bill Belichick eats up. So I just I don't know. I don't know. I don't I wouldn't be scared of them if I were you Hey guys, how you playing right now with how you play? Right?

Michael Marcangelo:

Yeah, there's one team, it's the bucks. I'm not scared of the Cardinals. Because I think if you get into a situation like that, and it's not because of, you know, of Kyler I think he's, I think he's, he's doing amazing. Hopkins always kills us. That's fine. kills everybody. He goes, everybody. So, Bill, if Bill takes away Hawkins, Bill also does really well against against mobile quarterbacks, right? Because he doesn't rush them. He just puts two spies on the edges and makes them become pocket passers. And I think we would get into a situation where Kingsbury would try to out think or out coach Bill. So yeah, it's, yeah, it's really the bucks.

Dave Clarke:

And it's the bucks. It's the bucks because I mean, this is obviously a pretty, pretty insane hypothetical. We're calling two teams to go to the Super Bowl here. But it's the books to me, because

Michael Marcangelo:

that's all that is a wet dream of mine, Joe, versus Tom.

Dave Clarke:

I mean, honestly, it'd be great for the league, it'd be great for our show. It'd be really, it'd be really awesome. I would I would like let's entertain the hypothetical for a second. I have to say, I would favor Brady, not because of the personnel that he has, which is obviously superior, like, in Tampa Bay, I would, I would favor him. I would, I'm gonna say if that happens, I'm gonna get on this show. And I'm gonna say something going into that week. Like, sucks that you guys played him in the season. Sucks for you guys that you played him in the seasons? Because like, I don't, you know, it's like you could take them to a super bowl and beat him how you beat them in the regular season this year. Like, you're not gonna be able to judge him twice. Right now. He's just he's Tom Brady. It's not like I would if he it but honestly, what a great chat we're gonna have because if Bill Belichick can come up with another way to beat him and beat him two times in the season that's it it's decided bills last guy you know, we lost? No, I know. I know. But I mean it's a moral victories more of the more the more the world victories it doesn't seem like a win, doesn't it? See us Ya know, and like, you guys came away with so many like, to the point where I'm like, like, like the moral victory that you came away with in that in that in that regular season game I think was was enormous. It kicks out the whole rest of your season. Look where you are now because of how you guys played in the game? Yeah, and like, I honestly just, yeah, I don't know if he gets another look at you. It's gonna be weird, but you did fuck him up. Like you made him play bad. You know, like, yes, they still won. But you made him play bad. That's a That's a victory. That was a W for Bill in the bill. Way. Not a bit of W for the Patriots. But in the bill versus Tom debate. It was a W for Bill, in my opinion.

Michael Marcangelo:

Yeah. And, you know, I don't want to throw shade at Bobby. But yeah, you do not know Not really. Like the Cowboys are much superior athletic team. Right? Like they have more talent. But if we get a chance to play them again. I think Bill now knows what to do. Because I think we saw

Dave Clarke:

a better time to play him now. Because I think mentally they just have sort of collapsed it on themselves.

Michael Marcangelo:

But I mean, if they make it to the Super Bowl, then then that's not gonna happen.

Dave Clarke:

Sorry. Sorry. That's not gonna happen. If we get we can spend any time talking about a Dallas Cowboys sir. Well, appearance right now. I'm sorry, that ship has sailed.

Michael Marcangelo:

Can I ask you a question? I actually have two questions. Yeah, this question. Monday, Monday night's game, patriots and Bill's like, as an outsider, right? Who do you like in that

Dave Clarke:

game? Right now I like to patriots if they play anybody. And I just think it's like I for me, it's like, yeah, I'm always very cautious about jumping on the bandwagon of like, they're finally done because I've just seen it so many times. Like I've just it's just you know, it's it's the touching the fucking pellet in the in the maze. You know, it shocks you every single time. Like, why bite? Why bite, you know, and it's like, I could see it. I could see the writing on the wall when Bobby was like doing a victory lap. Oh, Dallas Cowboy was being better than the Patriots now. And it's like, it's just like, don't do the victory lap until they until they ship out the rings. Do you know what I mean? It's like that. It's this is a fictitious season especially. But this sport is a fickle bitch. And the most consistent thing in my life for the past 2020 years, has been not counting out the New England Patriots. As much as I'd love to. You know, like, as long as that as long as that filthy old fucking Warlock runs your organization, he's going to be able to win football games. It's just the way it is. Also, as much as I was like pro bills last year, that was mainly because you made fun of me for draft and Josh Allen, then he had a great fantasy season. Now I could give a shit about them. And like really, from a neutral perspective, now that I don't have like a horse in that race. I don't really trust them. And like, yeah, they have like skill players. They have serious injuries on the defensive side of the ball, like he made like you made that point earlier. And like Josh Allen, like, I don't know, is he that dude?

Michael Marcangelo:

I'm not sure he's that dude. He could just be a better Jake. Like, I was gonna say Jake Plummer, but I really meant to say, Jay Cutler, you don't I mean, like he could be better.

Dave Clarke:

I mean, he's a lot more dynamic than Jay Cutler ever was. Yeah, but I That's kind of a prerequisite these days in today's NFL. Yeah. That's a damning indictment, right? Because Jay Cutler was a real piece of shit. I've never seen anybody who wanted to win less than that guy. So

Michael Marcangelo:

you had a few playoff runs? Right? Yeah. Great, great arm strength. Easy. I mean, the thing about Josh Allen. So, you know, on the show, I always talk about how the Mr. Jackson in the playoff game when the things get really tight, he can't hit the Windows, right? The same can be said about Josh Allen. He decreases his accuracy decreases the playoffs and you can't do that. But the difference between

Dave Clarke:

those two Yeah, it's hitting that like the deep ball is a is a thing that Josh Allen can do. And it will forever elude Lamar Jackson, because he can't teach that you can either throw it far or you can't. Right. So you know, and then also the it's just weird how that ravens offense is set up to like, it's like they they're on a tightrope. It's like they play on a tightrope, and you have to play like that. Well, Mr. Jackson, I'm just sure I'm just not sure that like a player that dynamic, but not malleable is like ever really going to work? I think you could get Josh Allen to figure it out. If you put the right people around him and like I think you can get you could basically what you're saying is you don't trust him. You don't trust you don't trust his mental. Like you you think like if you're going into Madden, and you went to like the stats, and you 99 Everything is mental would be like 33 You're saying it's just like he's just doesn't have the goods? Yeah.

Michael Marcangelo:

So I think I always hate like bringing it back to Brady, because that's that's such an annoying thing to do. But like even like a Peyton Manning type of thing.

Dave Clarke:

I mean, it's not a fucking Idaho sports podcast, like, you know, it's okay.

Michael Marcangelo:

They won games with their mind and they had and they have the strength to do it. Josh Allen strikes me as a guy who wants to win with his arm and doesn't think before he throws if that makes sense. He's got a little bit of a Brett Farve about him. Yeah, in that sense. Oh, yeah. And my second question

Dave Clarke:

Yeah, I like the patch though. If I was putting money on it, I'd be putting money in the past and

Michael Marcangelo:

again, why why? Why does it matter? Now? You still have a job.

Dave Clarke:

You're gonna talk about this. It's so you know, it's like it's weird, right? Because like, obviously I'm out on on naggy and I think the reason why I don't completely know you know I hate seeing my football team team lose games thing and like the play Collins frustrating all that stuff. He's just not the guy to turn Justin fields into the guy I know Justin fields can be Yep. And that's just super obvious. And it's super obvious to anyone who's watching and it's like, yeah, like he's not he's not a complete nincompoop. Like I think he's got like big flaws as a coach I think he's got things that he's good at things that he's not good at. It's not like completely black and white completely cut and dry. But you it became at its most obvious point. I think we all knew this. Anyone that like listens to me talk I'd like on this fucking podcast knows this already. But it became obvious for the whole world to see on Thanksgiving when everyone had to watch the bears because there was no one else on and we won that game with Andy Dalton because Matt naggy knows how to work and he don't and that's why he wanted to start him at the start of the season cuz he knows that about himself know how he knows how to make an Andy Dalton office work because he spent the entire offseason building in any diagnostic office. I was maybe he didn't listen to the pod but I was screaming for him not to do that for the entire the entire bucket run.

Michael Marcangelo:

I mean you had you had the bears at 11am to with what Justin field started because we all we all fork acid dog Yeah,

Dave Clarke:

let's let's not go down that way who got what predictions? You're not Mr. Fucking Seattle Seahawks? Are you? Hi.

Michael Marcangelo:

Let's let's get there. But you won on Thanksgiving. Because you played the lights? Right? Totally. So that's it, you

Dave Clarke:

didn't count. It shouldn't count for like an outside and non fireable offense. Beating the lions shouldn't count. You know, I was hoping we lose. I was honestly open we lose because a field is out. Don't put him back in. Don't be stupid. He's out for the season. It doesn't matter what like he's got cracked ribs. Just let him heal up. That was inevitable. And honestly, I'm glad that it was a couple of cracked ribs and not something worse because they were just like not doing a good job of protecting it. I think he's he's clearly got it. He had flashes this season of pure like, greatness in his athleticism. Like, I think he's top 1% of top 1% of athletes on the planet Earth. I think he's fucking lightning quick. I think he has the potential to be very, very smart. But there's, there's the big reason and I think his deep balls were really good. But I think that the defense or the defense, the reason why he dropped and it's there for everyone to see is that he has to develop pocket presence, which is trick or treat in the NFL. There's guys you can teach that too. And there's guys that you can't teach that to and I think because of the kind of guy is because of his character and everything I think you can teach that to him. But you need the right people there to teach you. The bears is an organization I think are trying to remain the the historic and classy franchise that they have always been in in it for the most part. I know you can tell me Brian Urlacher voted for Donald Trump and all but like at least he did all that shit after he

Michael Marcangelo:

wasn't I was gonna say but but I do have an idea of a scoop or a scandal but what we don't want to fight on this year. But

Dave Clarke:

I just I just think that they carry themselves like one of the NFL. oldest and most important organizations, they have the all time most wins in the NFL and unless you if you knew that they have more wins than anybody regular season wins. Um, but the just because they've been around the longest. I'm sure that's helpful. But the numbers don't lie. Like a wins a win. So I know they had to play like back in the 1939 General General Lee's

Michael Marcangelo:

army was after 1980 That counts if they still leave leave the league and

Dave Clarke:

we'd probably they aren't at the top of the list. But yeah, whatever man I'm just I'm taking the fucking dubs when I can. Yeah, the to my overall point I think that they're classy organization you know they're they're a family owned the guy who basically like put them on the map and made them who they are. George house is his daughter is the one who like runs the whole fucking thing now and she's a billion um, and she's just I just think that she runs it in an old school way and she's like, we're not going to fire the coach midseason it's just it's gauche. It's tacky it's it's stupid. Like let's just let them see it out. We gave them a job and we're gonna let them see the job and we're fucked now. Anyway, so who gives a shit? I mean, I'm not of that mind but I think that's how they're approaching it and it's been very frustrating for me to watch Maggie if even Ryan pace to have jobs come week, one of the offseason like I don't even know like I don't even know what they're putting in that lady's unsure at this point because like it's crazy to me I can see why they fired him if that's the reason that's on all the blogs and forums that's what everyone's arguing so I could see it but it's just still depressing. What's the scoop or scandal who who did what now it's like his family's new

Michael Marcangelo:

No no, I don't want to do that. So I'll let you have the the classy organization what happened what am I missing? What happened? Oh like the lat the GM of the bears from like 1999 through 2000 and he would repeatedly not disclose the league when domestic assault or domestic violence really perked yeah he would say today you just like surge like bearish GM not disclose once that you mean was he the GM the old Miami coach now yeah he was the you I think enough I don't know but you know when you see it like you can like it's not like they're they weren't doing anything else. I would assume that any other GM wasn't didn't hear

Dave Clarke:

about this at all I have maybe it's because I'm on all the bears forums when I let me look it up on I want to look up the guy's name because that I didn't even get to the to America. Until then, as I remember Dictor on taking over. Yeah, that's what it was dictated on took over. Oh, the GM. Yeah, not the coach. The the GM and the coach. Okay, copy that. GM front office. Add McCaskey new couldn't have been him. I don't know. I don't even know who this guy is that you're talking about?

Michael Marcangelo:

Jerry Harris. Hello. Oh, I remember that guy. Yeah, yeah,

Dave Clarke:

he was always a little slimy. Yeah, I remember that. Dude.

Michael Marcangelo:

He would he would purposely not disclose or hide abuse incidents so that so that his players won't have to, you know, sit out, but it's a bummer. It's awful. But whatever. Aaron

Dave Clarke:

Hernandez killed the guy. Fuck you guys. Just kidding. I'm sorry. Like,

Michael Marcangelo:

he's like, he's the only person in history to be guilty before he killed himself. Once he killed himself. He's innocent. And now they reinstated the verdict these guilty.

Dave Clarke:

Why did he come innocent? I don't remember. I didn't watch the documentary. It's

Michael Marcangelo:

like it's like a weird Massachusetts state law. But we're rabbit hole.

Dave Clarke:

If you if you played for the Patriots, you can't be guilty of murder is that

Michael Marcangelo:

fucking Josh will be the head coach of the Chicago Bears next year and he will do wonders with Justin fields. You know, he will do you know you will.

Dave Clarke:

I can't watch that fucking slothful. shikaka. He's like, Justin, Justin, here's the deal, man. More than three and a half yards. It's a failure of a play. Okay, we need to just make sure that three and a half less than three and a half yards. It's a failure of a clinic. It's like that's how many yards we get for for offensive possession.

Michael Marcangelo:

And it won't be worse than this year and I think if he does go there it will be it will far exceed your expectations. I mean, he already failed as head coach. So Ah yeah sure sure why but in reality

Dave Clarke:

honestly I'll take anybody at this point I'll hang out by the bus stop given our fucking rumors just to see if somebody will come and be the head coach of the Chicago Bears because at this point it's fucking bleak you know it's we're not good this thing is we're not the kind of organization as much as we haven't been like amazing for the past 20 years I mean we didn't make a Super Bowl but like we didn't win like there there abouts. You know, like middling it's almost worse to be middling it's it is the worst Yeah, you know, cuz it's like then you don't fail enough to go and get like a first overall pick. But I mean, the Steelers have been drafted fucking stud wide receivers out of the, the you know, 20th for the last fucking 15 years so I don't understand why we can't whatever it doesn't matter would be we're not the kind of franchise where it's like we're we're almost beating lions like this is very upsetting you know, especially on like national TV it's you should be no identity. Like I said this with Bobby The other week. There's just no identity there. And it's like it's obvious for all the world to see how why does he still have a job though? To answer your initial question? It's like, they don't like they don't like to fire coaches midseason. For you know, whether it's because they're classy, or they're just trying to be classy. i That's why. But yeah, I don't know. I'll probably go to the bus stuff and give out rumors anyway. Because it's a fun pastime, and you meet a lot of new interesting people that way.

Michael Marcangelo:

Good. Flick the perfect segue to the power ranking. See,

Dave Clarke:

I was gonna say we should do that the power ratings. Let me pull it up here. I'm going to I'm going to do it like how, like how the general public will do I'm going to put it right on my Instagram. I think I think me and Bobby, were talking about how there's less of a controversy in our group chat about the Power Rankings now because everyone is weird and sucks. So it's like, when he makes the power ranking, it makes the bearings now everyone's kind of like, yeah, I guess I don't know. Everyone says

Michael Marcangelo:

he didn't miss this chance to have the Cowboys at one because there was a week or two there that arguably they were the best team in the league. Yeah. And he just didn't want to do it. Because you know, because he's like, I wish I have them right here if you if you want

Dave Clarke:

me to. There you go ahead because we haven't posted them on the Instagram yet. Yeah. So

Michael Marcangelo:

Craig, you want to go 10 to one or one to 10

Dave Clarke:

I do want to do this to go from the worst of the best. Yeah.

Michael Marcangelo:

Remember 10 The Cincinnati Bengals at seven and four. Right. We had an

Dave Clarke:

argument about whether it should be them or the Titans today. And I think it's a no brainer. I agree with you. We still find a way to argue about it. Even though we're agreeing Yeah, they look really good against the Steelers like they fucked the Steelers up like you know, bad news bears and Well, I think a lot of that is that the Steelers are kind of trash, but because Jesus Christ is watching Ben Roethlisberger not just like he's I think he's one of the worst five cool starting quarterbacks and you know,

Michael Marcangelo:

this is near and dear to my heart, but it's like, it's like watching fat Elvis on stage, dude. Like, it's just like, you know, it's the end. You know, it's over Somebody

Dave Clarke:

get him a cheeseburger and and politely guide him to the toilet because it's over. It's over. It's over. Yeah, he knows. He knows. He knows about as much about being a quarterback in the NFL, as he knows about consent these days. Because like, it's, it's he makes good choices. He makes good decisions on the field on the field. He makes good decisions. Because he's been in the league for like, a billion years, but he still thinks he has the same army he had five years ago and he's got a little fucking noodle arm. And my favorite part is he throws little shitty noodle arm passes. And like his receivers, you're doing everything they can happen if they don't, or they inevitably gets picked. He's like, What? What guys? Come on. It's a good stupid, right? It's like dude, they've needed a new head coach and quarterback tandem in Pittsburgh for like, let's be honest, like at least five years.

Michael Marcangelo:

He's like Peyton, without the intelligence. Or at least Peyton knew

Dave Clarke:

when it was time. Yeah, Peyton was smart enough to go and get it again that last year Bowl ring like it kind of carried by like a dope defense and like, just do exactly what you need to do. That office is still built like

Michael Marcangelo:

even for this burger. Yeah.

Dave Clarke:

Can play quarterback she's Can't you know, it's it's too bad. Yeah, like if you put Ben Roethlisberger in New England say Mack Jones wasn't having a great time. You put them in New England, and he did exactly what Bill Belichick told him to do. He'd have a great season, he'd have a better he's probably a better season than Mack Jones is having right now. Because he just knows he makes good choices if he was just 100% tuned into what a very smart head coach was was telling him to do based on what he's able to do physically. He'd be having a great season but he isn't so he's not if you're not had balls she'd be your uncle but she does it so she is you know what I mean?

Michael Marcangelo:

Never died never died. The Los Angeles Rams seven for

Dave Clarke:

over overrated but like nine is fine, like overrated in general by the public but nine is fine.

Michael Marcangelo:

Eight, the Dallas Cowboys. It's seven and four. It's Because of that loss of the Raiders, man, I know that you you hate the Raiders. I get it.

Dave Clarke:

Yeah, they should be beating the Raiders. That's what that's why I hate the Raiders. They should be beating the fucking Raiders. The Raiders are not good.

Michael Marcangelo:

The Ravens at eight and three and number seven. Yeah, they're

Dave Clarke:

like maybe the worst state and three team in the history of the NFL.

Michael Marcangelo:

There. Yeah. Yeah. But, but like you said earlier they have, they can be so good, but they're but you can figure them out.

Dave Clarke:

It's or you can figure them out. And it turns out, I think I mean, four interceptions, dude, like, that's fucking JB.

Michael Marcangelo:

That's bad. Did he throw three in one quarter? yet? Did

Dave Clarke:

he just completely like derailed that? Like I lost a fantasy because of it. It hurt. I didn't. I didn't enjoy it.

Michael Marcangelo:

And number six, the Buffalo Bills and seven four. They're beautiful. I mean, I mean, the culture is fucking spankin clothes are better than everyone's thought though. They got beat. Yep. Number five the Kansas City Chiefs at seven four. That's their scary team.

Dave Clarke:

Yeah, I mean they could at any point they could at any point make this season boring again and just be like in the City Chiefs again. It's it's all the same guys. So

Michael Marcangelo:

the Tampa Bay Buccaneers at number four at eight and three. Make sense? Still Still Tom Brady. Now here's here's the really interesting part. And Mike it's cool but he has Bobby has the Cardinals at three at nine and two below the Patriots. Who are the number two spot at four? What's the justification there? Because I can't even I can't justify that

Dave Clarke:

strength of schedule now I would put Yeah, I would. I would put the Cardinals above the Patriots right now for sure. Cardinals

Michael Marcangelo:

are winning with Colton coy Yeah. Yeah, that's

Dave Clarke:

he gave the same we gave the same rationale to the Titans when they won two games after Derrick Henry went down

Michael Marcangelo:

that we did he did me drop them from like fourth to eighth

Dave Clarke:

Yeah, we both say we did like we were we were trying to make the same argument. It's like well, you're they're still waiting so that should count for right yeah, it's that's weird. That's weird. No, I you know what if he does, I think he thinks I think he predicts that the Patriots are going to finish with a better record than the cartels wish they could be true.

Michael Marcangelo:

Maybe. And then number one, the biggest fraud in the NFL. Is the Green Bay Packers nine and three

Dave Clarke:

How are you not going to put them number one like they have be all the teams that they're supposed to be and they beaten good teams? Like if you'd like do you think the rams are good? You said they were scary. You said the rams are scary Mike earlier in the show it's on record and you said you're scared of them and Aaron Rodgers fucked them up you know I don't know I don't want them to be good either. Man. It hurts me too. But maybe they are I really probably will show them the playoffs but that doesn't mean they're not good right now and no deserve and they're just

Michael Marcangelo:

so one dimensional.

Dave Clarke:

But that one dimension is winning.

Michael Marcangelo:

I think he's a he's a a freak quarterback really. But I mean they did you know they have lost to New Orleans, Kansas City and Minnesota. Those aren't great losses. Kansas City are very good. Not when they played Sure Sure. Sure.

Dave Clarke:

They kind of but they kind of by much like the Patriots that the Packers started off a little a little sketchy at the start of the season and had to pull it pull it around and into their credit they have the Packers

Michael Marcangelo:

started seven one Yeah, didn't but didn't look like shit week one didn't they look absolutely terrible. It was 32 Jamis was like It turns

Dave Clarke:

out New Orleans or fucking trash so it's which makes a lot of sense obviously. But you know that's a battle. You gotta you gotta you got to give you gotta let him slide on that one because it's like Week One. Everything was weird. They got it together. Yeah, I agree. I did they have very like 15 and one Atlanta Falcons vibes to me like it's like once it comes down to it. I wonder if they're gonna you know if they can shit or get off the pot. And I think like you said, Rodgers, he is he needs people to get out of his way for him to win a Super Bowl in an aggressive way. He needs people shooting themselves in the dick constantly for him to win a Super Bowl and like that is 100% one habit that bears team that color like fucking basically was like mine floaters or whatever. And I'm going to ride the bike and look like I don't give a shit. I blacked out on fucking vodka that night. really brought the television in our house and I was screaming bears D like state car farm commercials. But yeah, like that wasn't even that good of a bear's seem to be 100% honest with you. And right. He needed Jay Cutler to be like the biggest pussy on Earth for them to even make it to the zero out here. Like we they were trying to give us that game like were they were really honestly like trying to let us have that game and they're a much better team than we were that are much, much better.

Michael Marcangelo:

Oh, yeah. I mean, Roger Rogers. Rogers is immunized against playoff success.

Dave Clarke:

That's it. Oh, man. What did you it was so satisfying. I have to say just on a personal level, it was it went exactly like this. The Packers beat the bears nothing fucking new there. He goes, I still own you and it gets picked up and everyone's like, oh shit, that hurts. And in the sports world, everybody's like, ooh, that does suck Aaron Rodgers who put his balls on your head, and then he proceeded to out him himself as the stupidest man on earth. Like, thank you, Aaron. Thank you so much for turning in that fucking tour de force performance of dumb fuckery oh, what's going on? He's like horse paste. Joe Rogan? I'm like, yes, no. What are they what are hilarious and amazing. So whether he wins or not, like, I'm even super. I'm surprised that guy can even get on the fucking team bus or like, find his way home or like not, it's his little pantaloons. Every time he has to fucking urinate. He's the stupidest book I've ever seen in my entire life. He's out there with all these other dumb fucking idiots. Be in like, the Vixie it's like there's like a billion people have gotten these stupid fuck, everyone's fine. I'm like growing arms out of the side of my head like fucking prints. Goro for Mortal Kombat. Don't ask Joe Rogan for medical advice. Aaron, you stupid asshole. You can win as many syllables as you want. I'll always be smarter than you. And so will anyone with more than a fourth grade education you fucking roofshingle Thank you and good night Aaron Rodgers. Oh, what a hilariously perfect man he is. Thank you so much, Aaron. Thank you. You still own us? You don't even own the full control of your faculties. You fucking nugget.

Michael Marcangelo:

Anyways, moving on. Yeah, no, I don't think they're really there. Yeah, I agree. I'm glad we can agree is there

Dave Clarke:

I don't think I'm gonna be able to match the energy again. So we should probably just call it a night on the show. That feels that feels right. Well, thanks, everybody for coming. Mike. Thanks for coming to the show. And Megan very good points about Baseball Hall of Fame Hall of Fame's is it like attorneys general? Is there more than one Hall? The Baseball Hall of Fame. It's just the one making good points about then I agree with most I think we've agreed kind of generally tonight about a lot of things which is always kind of new and novel for us. Yeah. I mean the same thing. So that was redundant. But other than that, thanks for coming, everyone. Craig. Thanks for producing the show as always, and I really hope Aaron Rodgers gets my message. Alright, have a good night, everybody.